View Full Version : Project: PolarRAM
well, it's been a good long run, but my 2008 GMC has been around 11 years. i made it thru the payments, thru the wear items going bad, and am now firmly in the "stupid broken **** again" age. i ran it hard and put it away wet, never really kept it clean, she lived outside, etc. she's still doing good, but it's time to move her along before it's just not worth anything.
so used trucks kinda suck from when they were figuring out computers, the newest generations are sooooo much better. the late model used/new market is just beyond stupid right now, and i suspect that won't change any time soon. so that leaves old trucks, and i love old trucks. seams reasonable to replace my old, high mileage truck with something older, and even higher miles right? yup!
the 55 is coming along, but i will need time to trust it before i can tow across the state. my trust in the GMC is going away quicker than the 55's will grow. it's also a regular cab and short inside, i wish i had the body skills to stretch the cab. it's also a no-salt project rig, need a winter/back-up tow rig. why have one new when you can have a few old for the same money?!?!?! need something that'll tow the enclosed with my YJ, something 4x4, something not regular cab cuz i'm tall and need more room. but also something that isn't a 4dr long bed with a school bus wheelbase.
SO ... 1st Gen Cummins Ram Club Cab. was looking for something bone-stock and preferably a W350 12v 5spd 4x4 drw, but they just are stupid rare for sale. a number of 4x2, but the 4x4 are being horded. found this W250 though! she's a lot more built up than i was looking for, but quite clean.
made a deal and flying down to Glufport, MS next Thursday with the wife. buying it Friday morning, then driving to Nashville to spend 2 nights for a mini-vacation, and drive home sunday. wish me luck!
https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/262815542417235/?ref=saved&referral_code=null
https://i.imgur.com/qxnFzX0.jpg
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MBood82
11-03-2021, 09:12 AM
That thing looks nice! And much of the work looks to be the stuff you want done, not typical diesel bro mods. Crossover steering alone is a nice upgrade.
The fact that it also makes nice power is icing on the cake.
xj_man_646
11-03-2021, 09:15 AM
Sweet truck for sure.
I considered a 1st gen as a DD / tow rig exactly one time :lol:. The fact that this one actually has power is a huge step in the right direction though.
That thing looks nice! And much of the work looks to be the stuff you want done, not typical diesel bro mods. Crossover steering alone is a nice upgrade.
The fact that it also makes nice power is icing on the cake.
i've seen some other sketchy crossover, i like this kit. it also has a full steering box brace already. good traction bars, good fueling upgrades, 2nd fuel tank in place of the spare tire, etc.
Sweet truck for sure.
I considered a 1st gen as a DD / tow rig exactly one time :lol:. The fact that this one actually has power is a huge step in the right direction though.
it's kind of tuned for a dyno however, so it's smokey until the PSI's kick in he said. i want nothing to do with driving a smokey truck. specially if it's fogging my pretty white trailer, so that'll need addressed.
i've been researching and learning P7100 tuning ... time to shift gears n learn the VE
xj_man_646
11-03-2021, 09:56 AM
VE tuning is a bit easier IIRC...turn the screw :lol:
With enough fuel to support compounds on the top end, I think you will be battling smoke on the bottom regardless of what you do, depending on the smaller turbo. 60mm isn't huge but I do not know what stock VE pump 12vs came with either.
xj_man_646
11-03-2021, 09:57 AM
Also get ready to ditch those traction bars. That's the style that a lot of diesel bros like to run, but doesn't allow for any change in arc length with suspension travel. A friend of mine used to sell those to the local diesel kids and said they ride like trash because of it.
Also get ready to ditch those traction bars. That's the style that a lot of diesel bros like to run, but doesn't allow for any change in arc length with suspension travel. A friend of mine used to sell those to the local diesel kids and said they ride like trash because of it.
i've been curious of that too
i'm also thinking there's a chance i ditch the 4" block. we'll see how it goes
xj_man_646
11-03-2021, 10:54 AM
The 4" block might be factory. From what I can see, you'd probably be squat truck mode if you did that. Unless you're trying to lower the whole thing.
The 4" block might be factory. From what I can see, you'd probably be squat truck mode if you did that. Unless you're trying to lower the whole thing.
agreed, i would assume the 4" block is factory too. it has a 6" front spring though, so i could lower that some. even use a 2" block instead might be nice. i'm not a block fan at all though, even if factory.
maybe ditch the block and coble a factory pack with the 6" pack to make a 2" front? ... who knows. we'll see. i have to drive it for a while before messing with it to get the big parts of the 55 bolted together.
xj_man_646
11-03-2021, 11:27 AM
I'm assuming you'd need to step down a tire size if you lower the front much?
I wonder if a shackle flip is an option to maintain some height and ditch the blocks. The part I do appreciate about blocks is that they don't change the spring rate / ride quality.
Hoofmann
11-03-2021, 02:06 PM
Oh my god. I’m jealous.
nblehm
11-04-2021, 04:42 PM
300k miles, rusty floors 20k... :eek:
xj_man_646
11-04-2021, 04:57 PM
That's where my mind went.
But...it doesn't seem absurd given the 1st gen market, and the used truck market in general.
The dealer my dad bought his 2020 Raptor from for 55k, bought it back earlier this year for 70k :eek:
300k miles, rusty floors 20k... :eek:
at this age the miles don't matter to me, just the maintenance.
and that one spot is the ONLY spot of rust from a leaking heater core, super easy fix non-issue. the rest of the truck, as far as i can tell, is SUPID clean
so we agreed on $18k, and yeah it was more than i wanted to pay for sure. i was shooting for 15 even on this one at the moment. But after a few months of looking this was by far the closes to the pin for what i want and the most reasonable price. there is similar stuff listed for $27k without the minor to-do list this one has. they seam to be selling, even the rusty junk, for good money.
xj_man_646
11-05-2021, 03:19 PM
How do the Getrags hold up with compound turbo power long term?
How do the Getrags hold up with compound turbo power long term?
from my research, every time someone swaps a ragged out getrag for a brand new or rebuild 4500 "IT SHIFTS SO MUCH BETTER!!" well no ****.
anyone who drives douchey enough to break a getrag behind a stock 12v can break a 5600 behind a stock cummins too. basically a little extra fluid helps get to the input bearing for lub, and PTO cover fluid coolers help keep the temps down while under extended load, then don't tow under 1800rpm to keep the gear chatter down.
WE MADE IT HOME!
what an adventure that was. Flew down Thursday night late, both dead when we got the hotel, i couldn't sleep like it was Christmas eve as a kid. he picked us up first thing in the AM, truck was as-advertised, so off we went. bank for the deposit and notary, then back to his house to drop him off. he sold this cuz he got a new daily, a TRX! i demanded a ride before we left :lol:
were 5miles from the coast, so we drove down for lunch on the beach. pan fried grouper taco :drool: walked the beach for a few minutes, toes in the Gulf, and then headed north. 500miles the first day was basically uneventful and pleasant. though, the wife did use my noise canceling over-ear headphone the whole ride :lol: stopped Friday night in Nashville, and spent Saturday looking around.
Day 2: breakfast on Broadway, live music, tchotchke shops, etc. even taco bell was bad ass! the tours of drunks at 11am were the best though, holy hell. tractor pulled hay rides, monster truck rides in the city, you name it. city ppl who came to the city to party like it's the country! toured the crazy opry hotel before going to the opry for the Saturday night show. best part was Billy Ray Cyrus singing Achy Breaky live! :rock:
Day 3: headed home, 575mi, again was uneventful for the truck. got a clicking in the steering when not moving, but was just a loose aftermarket box brace. and no heater still. left early and stopped into the Corvette Museum at opening. totally worth stopping, but can't say i'd have driven there just for that. everything was great until it got cold, rainy, and even snowed. as the sun set the cab stopped holding heat and the windows started to fog up on us. i kept running the defrost to wash the warmer moist air out so i could see, but this froze the wife. she had the DeWalt heated jacket on, hat n gloves, like 4 pairs of socks (one mine), then my spare jeans over her yoga pants, all wrapped in a sweater, still wearing my noise canceling headphones over her hears. on a scale of 1-10, loving it to tuck n roll jumping out the window in front of traffic ... she was about a 9 for the last 3h. :(
but we made! what an awesome adventure of a weekend!
https://i.imgur.com/tYEKZ3I.jpg
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xj_man_646
11-15-2021, 12:25 PM
When I went to look at the 1st gen I considered buying, it was cold (pre-winter, but cold)...the guy just straight up removed the mechanical cooling fan as he claimed the truck never heated up in winter :lol:.
Would the engine build enough heat but the cab heat needs attention?
heater core is bypassed after it started leaking ... but in MS he didn't need it and that was like 4 years ago :lol:
he sent me with a new core, and even stainless lines for on the engine.
Cobound
11-15-2021, 01:55 PM
Bad ass truck.
Killer trek!
As always, keeper wife :lol:
Nice, dude - great story, great truck! Enjoy!
ok ... so i have never been a fan of smokey diesel trucks. and this one is basically dyno tuned, so it takes a very careful pair of feet to not fog the road behind me. not a puff at take off or something, it will blatantly roll coal if you smash it going down an on ramp. i need to tune that out ASAP for my sanity, and for the sake of my white trailer.
HOWEVER ... when you've done all that slow and calculated acceleration to get to speed without smoke, and a Prias cuts you off making you smash the brakes ... the shear will power it takes to not fog him as you go around takes serious concentration. :james:
Hoofmann
11-16-2021, 11:02 AM
:lol:
Just do it.
Cobound
11-16-2021, 01:50 PM
:roflmao:
xj_man_646
11-16-2021, 03:44 PM
Does it clean up under boost or will it roll coal through the whole range?
down low it's hard to not smoke, but possible ... it cleans up for partial throttle, but at WOT it rolls pretty much the whole range
In the 10 Commandments of driving a 12v, the FIRST is "thou shall carry a 17mm wrench"
well, i wasn't. fukking 65deg yesterday, i left work early to play outside since it probably won't be this nice again until April. NOPE! spent 3hours on the side of the road waiting for a tow 4 miles from home. was full of fuel, but apparently if you drive it a certain way, (kinda racecar like :james: ) it'll air lock the injectors. once home, 2 minutes with a 17mm wrench and she was running strong again. uuuugghhhh
17mm wrench added to console.
https://c.shld.net/rpx/i/s/i/spin/10000595/prod_2305980312?
Cobound
11-18-2021, 11:49 AM
Damn.
xj_man_646
11-18-2021, 04:06 PM
How...does it get air in the system? That makes no sense conceptually, in my brain. Does it still have the mechanical lift pump?
no, it's actually running an airdog lift pump. and i'm with ya, seams weird as hell, i've talked thru the possible cavitation/suction etc with a few ppl and not found much online. but have found other ppl who have the same issue with other kinds of diesels.
i guess it's not a P7100 issue, just the VE being a low-power auto only pump.
Hoofmann
11-19-2021, 11:48 AM
That happened to me but it was -15
had a few friends in town this past weekend ... but couldn't show off the new truck cuz the starter internally shorted out on me Thursday before work. turns out it was already weak, so i guess all my cranking with the fuel issue Wednesday finally killed it. was finally able to pick up a new starter Sunday and she pins WAY better. Hank made it to work today.
actually told the previous owner and he was all mad he hadn't figure it out before. he had replaced the cables with new super HD ones trying to solve the slow spin.
So the phone holding situation is pretty bad in Hank. i started digging into what i could build without drilling holes and found a bulb-less map light. seems like a great place to integrate a mount, and it would be great to have a light there. so i pulled the light body, threw it in 3D, and printed off this little guy.
1" ball mount based on RAM mount dimensions
pocket for LED flush mount light
pocket for toggle switch
cross your fingers the wiring to it is still good :lol: i ordered the phone mount/case, LED, and switch this morning ... will update as it comes together.
https://i.imgur.com/9K6QbKY.jpg
Cobound
11-22-2021, 05:24 PM
3D printer for the win :rock:
Man, I love those things...had considered buying one, but it'd just be another trinket that collected dust like so many other things I needed and never used :lol:
Have a buddy that uses one and is crazy good w/ it, builds some off the wall stuff - actually does props builds from movies, like pro type stuff, has his own business and sells them - it's crazy cool.
You really have some projects :p
that'll work! now i just need the rest of the parts to show up ...
https://i.imgur.com/5LmpDK3.jpg
Cobound
11-24-2021, 11:58 AM
Is that a CD and cassette deck? So ahead of it's time :lol:
Those are so obsolete now, my '13 Ram didn't even have a CD slot :p
Is that a CD and cassette deck? So ahead of it's time :lol:
Those are so obsolete now, my '13 Ram didn't even have a CD slot :p
hell yeah CD/Tape deck! i use it daily with a bluetooth adapter plugged into the tape adapter :lol:
hopefully eventually replace the "information center" with a double din touchscreen with wireless android auto.
so i messed with the tune some, learned how to drive better, and she's less smokey day to day now. still need to play with it a little, but it got cold.
speaking of not wrenching outside on it, ProEagle jack FTMFW!! pulled in angled to "the daily" side of the garage and then dragged the tail up in on the jack. was able to replace the heater core with heat. cuz that junk took a while. could do it WAY faster now, but hopefully i don't ever need to. thought it does provide great access to the 2nd turbo :lol:
https://i.imgur.com/P6q1cNb.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/R7kzV4I.jpg
Cobound
11-30-2021, 01:00 PM
Gat damn, you got a Pro Eagle jack...dude, that might be the one most jealous thing I have on this thread :lol:
Super pimp, but even at $100 off, couldn't justify it :p
Yeah, this is heating season, bro!
Gat damn, you got a Pro Eagle jack...dude, that might be the one most jealous thing I have on this thread :lol:
Super pimp, but even at $100 off, couldn't justify it :p
Yeah, this is heating season, bro!
yeah, i was pretty skeptical too ... but i'd buy another in a heartbeat without ever thinking about the cost now. they are THAT nice in the shop, and even better off road.
got it up and working! love the light, but need to change some things around. also adding some extra detail.
i posted this in a FB 1st gen group and have been slammed with ppl wanted to buy one. i'm going to try and get the 3D printer files out there once updated for ppl to make their own.
https://i.imgur.com/R8YVP3N.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/tkp3OP6.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/OmP6q5J.jpg
Cobound
11-30-2021, 02:22 PM
yeah, i was pretty skeptical too ... but i'd buy another in a heartbeat without ever thinking about the cost now. they are THAT nice in the shop, and even better off road.
Dude, that's great to hear...I cannot stomach the cost.
Of course, if I did get one I'd be lambasted for it...you, on the other hand, are commended :lol:
Nice buy, dude!!!
Cobound
11-30-2021, 02:23 PM
Dude, that lil deal is bad ass. Nice of you to provide the details for others to use...but damn, son, not everyone has a printer...so make some money - yo!
:rock:
xj_man_646
11-30-2021, 05:43 PM
you should keep the original stereo and use a bluetooth FM transmitter. New ones are really powerful. I did not have to change stations when I drove my f-250 from Montana to Minnesota. I'm almost considering swapping the OEM stereo back into my GMC because I hate the speaker they had to install to maintain the door / alert chime (as it comes through the factory stereo).
no, i'll be swapping out the radio for sure, this thing is wonky at best. the speakers were swapped at some point back in the day, but could be swapped again n re-wired this time.
thinking about doing it with a new dash maybe ... but we'll see.
https://classicdash.com/product/1981-93-dodge-truck-3-3-8-dash-panel/
https://classicdash.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/05/707811131-600x450.jpg
nblehm
12-04-2021, 05:37 PM
Leave the heater box out and the turbo may heat the cab for you:lol:
Leave the heater box out and the turbo may heat the cab for you:lol:
while heat is nice ... AC is even better! ;)
been a bit and still love the truck, so that's a win! even sold the GMC for WAY too much money, so double win.
the heater blower stopped working so the last guy wired in a huge constant duty relay and janky wiring. while doing the heater core i saw that the heater blower resister was unplugged and wondered if on purpose or not. decided ot try it, wired it all back to factory, plugged it in, and everything works the way it should now! janky wiring trashed.
the front drive shaft has no needles in one cap in the joint at the axle, and the CV at the t-case is blown out. but the NP205 front output also has more play than i'd like, so it'll also get a rebuild kit this spring some time. but while i was inspecting all this, i also saw that the 2 bolts holding the trans mount to the cross member were loose. one missing the nut entirely, the other nut was 2 threads from falling off :james:
next major fix though is clutch hydro's. the master is leaking down and not giving me full travel. plus i guess a braided line helps get just a TAD more throw at the slave from less expansion. i also made an adjustable master push rod from the new one since the clutch pedal is a little lower than the brake and i could get a little more travel there too. if i can get just a weee bit more release this tranny should be much easier to shift.
but the biggest win was cleaning up the shop and organizing the 55. getting it back on it's own feet so i could toss it on some casters to get hank in the garage!! warm wrenching FTW
https://i.imgur.com/fvr70rD.jpg
oh, totally forgot i also bought another 12v :lol:
the nv4500 "swap kit" is for a buddy with a 96 who's auto is last legs.
so i've been having issues with the VE pump, basically cuz the truck is wicked up too much. First is the AFC (air fuel control) spring, it's WAY wrong leading to a lot of smoke and i assume extra turbo lag. i characterized the spring and ordered a selection of stiffer ones to hopefully fix the fuel map.
second, the pump will stall and just shut the engine off. with high boost comes high cylinder pressures, high enough that if i let off the throttle too fast it'll actually shove combustion back into the injectors and air lock them. the pump will shut down pressure faster than the cylinders and the poppet valves can't hold back enough pressure. easy fix, 3minutes to blead em and go again, but having to dead drift to the side of the road blows. if i let off slowly it's no issue, just a quick lift when trying to shift fast. the only fix for this is to swap on a P-Pump where this mechanically isn't possible. no clue when i'll finally swap it, but now i have the parts.
between not being able to let off the throttle quick, and the clutch needed to disengage more to shift easier, i actually spend more time shift than accelerating in a 0-60 run :lol: i believe the dyno numbers cuz she'll set you back in the seat when the turbo's light, but that's like these wee little glimpses of goodness.
https://i.imgur.com/PrFFuuj.jpg
nblehm
01-16-2022, 05:34 PM
:rock:
A solid looking garage line up
so i started to play real tuning games with the injection. at full 60psi boost the smoke cleaned up so i suspect the injectors are sized close to properly. my research also suggests that. i know they do still put out extra fuel though since i have a dyno run where they fogged the air filter with NOS and it did make more power. 501hp to be exact. now down low they are a bit big at min pump output so i think no matter what she'll fart if i bog it on a start or smash the throttle at low R's. however, the middle ground could use some work.
i was told it had the stock AFC (air fuel control) spring in it, so that would bring in full fuel by 18psi. this spring acts against a diaphragm driven by the boost psi to compensate fuel.
needless to say it smoked a lot, and was way over-fueled most of the time. well i bought a 0-700lb spring pressure tester and characterized the stock spring. then ordered 5 different springs with the same OD and height, but different spring constants. this should let me pick a nice rate of change. i can also tighten the pre-load to adjust where it starts moving.
my thought was if i'm running 3.75x more psi, and i wanted the same travel in the diaphragm, i needed a 3.75x stiffer spring rate. functionally i don't think that's working though because of the minimum preload and stopping too much fuel down low. first test was the stiffest spring i got, and i couldn't quite get to full boost, so fueling seams limited up top. basically can't get the fuel to get the boost to move the diaphragm for more fuel. :lol: and that's with minimum preload. next spring is a mid range stiffness with more preload to start ... stay tuned.
xj_man_646
01-27-2022, 09:01 AM
Interesting stuff. This might be one of the more in-depth dives into 12v 'tuning' I've seen, especially on the rotary pump engines.
For the p-pump engine, have you considered one of those adjustable fuel plates, so you can dial up the fuel when you want power but can dial it down to reduce smoke and gain fuel efficiency? I can't recall who makes them but it basically slides back and forth with an adjustment knob of some sort.
the tuning logic is similar between the pumps, but the mods to gain min/max fueling are different, and obviously different parts. the P-Pump has a much wider range of operation to make all this easier, so i'll just start over at some point when i swap it.
the "in cab tuners" are way over priced to me. the big name, AFC live, is just a little box to modify the boost reference signal into the pump. an adjustable psi regulator, an orifice valve, and a bypass switch. basically set max fuel by lowering the max boost it see's, and the rate that fuel comes in by slowing the signal. the other is just basically an adjustable throttle stop inside the pump, again limiting max fuel. i'm going to build my own "AFC live" into the 55 for way cheaper. they are supposed to make a high HP setup easier to street daily.
the springs n screws still gota be set right in the pump though, these signal mods only fine tune that in one direction. something like the orifice might help mpg in the city, but you might be able to spool faster with more fuel for towing. not sure, still learning that part.
xj_man_646
01-27-2022, 04:59 PM
Once you're into the smoke, more fuel is just a waste. Just keep that in mind as you are playing with it.
Baby peez
01-27-2022, 09:13 PM
overfuel means you need a bigger turbo right?
xj_man_646
01-28-2022, 07:47 AM
overfuel means you need a bigger turbo right?
He's already got two :lol:.
He says it cleans up under full boost so I think peak fueling is appropriate for the turbo configuration. Just needs to tune up the other areas.
xj_man_646
01-28-2022, 12:06 PM
:lol: :lol:
Duramax. Cheap. Reliable. Ha!
My dad had an LBZ swapped Suburban and that thing was a nightmare. He had to deal with problematic injectors, fuel filter head, and injector return lines before giving up and sending it back to the builder. None of that should have had to do with the swap. The drivetrain had just over 100k miles allegedly.
What planet do you live on that anything associated with a Duramax is cheap???
Cobound
01-28-2022, 01:19 PM
You dare question wrath's knowledge of such things - prepare to be schooled :lol:
i started looking for a stock truck to ruin on my own, but this ultimately is a faster learning curve and more fun. :lol:
the weather turned sh!t again so i can't get enough traction to test for full boost. i think i still need to tighten up the AFC pre-load, but we'll see. i might never be able to get no smoke ever, but i'm now to the point that only the hippies would be mad.
nblehm
01-28-2022, 08:27 PM
:lol: :lol:
Duramax. Cheap. Reliable. Ha!
What planet do you live on that anything associated with a Duramax is cheap???
Right :roflmao:
I think even duramax guys don’t make those claims
oh man, so much better!!
first try was the 125lb spring, minimum preload. smoke down low was greatly reduced, but couldn't get full boost so i wasn't getting full fuel.
next was 90lb spring with 1.5 turns preload. touch more down low smoke than the 125, but got full fuel. added another turn of preload, similar or less low smoke but still not as little as the 125, but now i was getting full fuel.
119lb goes in with 1 turn preload. matched the minimum low smoke yet, and i can get to basically full fuel.
it drives WAY better now. the engine rev's happier to 3500, sounds better doing it, smoother, no smoke past the fart-on-go. boost comes in quicker and at lower throttle, i can actually hear the turbo's in normal driving!
i think ideal i would get a different fuel pin profile, but they are like $90 and that's a little bit much to just try. going to see if i can find a used one ...
not sure i posted it, but the new master cylinder is better. and the adjustable pushrod i made along with the braided stainless line were also well worth the upgrade. got the front CV driveshaft all rebuilt and tight, that was a messy pain but worth it. the drivability keeps getting better.
next big thing is dialing in the tire PSI and new adjustable shocks to match the springs. see if i can get this thing to settle down a bit on these older secondary roads.
xj_man_646
02-02-2022, 08:17 AM
Sounds like decent progress!
well, had a run-away with the 12V!
not bad, and i was ready for it, but happened. so i finally decided to start messing with the main fuel screw, and everyone cautions that if you go too far the pump will run away. so you pop off the charge pipe and have a board ready to snuff the air. i started turning and sure as ****, wife started it, idled ok, she rev'd it and it kept going after she let off. backed off a little and it would not accell, but crazy float it's way back down. so a little further back, comes down to idle ok, we'll call that max fueling!
the VE pump just really isn't capable of high end fueling ... i think i fixed the stalling issue letting out of the throttle at high power, but i just don't think it can push the fuel up there. so i'm back to wanting to P7100 swap it and be able to turn both trucks from the same learnings and spare parts.
what a weekend, damn.
started off with stripping old junk wiring. the old gauges had a bunch even thought they were all mechanical, the old brake controller, some other random junk under the dash, more random junk from under the hood, 2 switches in the dash that weren't hooked up, plus the old sub amp. that learning and being careful took a while, plus tracing the wires. found the old brake controller didn't work cuz the wires were cut off the plug at the hitch and just taped up. :james:
pulling the amp turned out to be amazing, all cuz i had to pull the seat. it not only got me a cubby under the seat, but if you look there are 6 holes in the bracket, the rear most 2 aren't used. so i drilled 2 new fwd holes and bolted the seat back in 2-1/8" further back!! the bracket is sloped and rounded so it tipped back slightly, got lower, and after a few washers on the front for a touch more recline is awesome. this is WAY more comfortable to drive now.
the new gauge is a 3-in-one and all read the same as the old 3, so that's good to know. but the real win is the viability and cleaning it up. windshield isn't blocked by the a-pillar pods, and my speedo isn't blocked by the column pod. i also only have to look at one place to get all 3 metrics and the tach vs up and down and all over to get em. only thing the new placement blocks is my view of the hood. one funny thing was they gave me a 60psi sender and a 120psi sender. well with 15psi fuel and 60psi boost it was easy to pick what went where. too bad that was backwards of the gauge set up so my fuel read double and the boost half. had to switch the wires at the gauge and since you can't change anything but back color my fuel is now labeled 'BOOST', boost is labeled 'PSI'. whatever, it works.
installing the fuel sender got interesting though. had to install a spacer cuz the sender totally locked out my throttle linkage. even with the tiny spacer it's like 0.5mm from hitting! i had to clock it just right.
so time for a test drive ... dash back lighting doesn't work, radio doesn't come on, no cig lighter to charge the phone, and the heater blower doesn't work. wtf did i break?!?! turns out when i pulled all the fuse taps the previous owners had they were too loose to make contact! had to tighten 3 different fuse receptacles in the block. now i'm down to only the heater blower not working ... it was colt this morning. in the process of trouble shooting i spent a little time with the truck in RUN but not on, as little as possible cuz the buzzer is intense. only to find that the injections pump is leaking fuel pretty bad around the throttle linkage, enough it made a puddle. easy enough fix to just replace the o-ring, fairly common, but more work to do.
next the P3 brake controller gets wired in, new rear shocks to match the new front, and the load bags for the back. gota be ready for towing season soon! even the deer are anxious for me to finish, they checked on me.
https://i.imgur.com/RGjFjVb.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/2PTKYL1.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/mTyNq6d.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/zOYR0h0.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/E70iiTY.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/CAEAz2R.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/bshqw2K.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/dyhH9ux.jpg
The deer are wondering when you're going to plant some deer candy (hostas).
those are on the other side of the porch :james:
got some more nice-to-have's installed, worked out great.
https://i.imgur.com/7lfQqW2.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/MsrpaU6.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/MLU9lmx.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/L8BVI4p.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/cIE1cgy.jpg
aannnddd ... kerfukkled
https://i.imgur.com/WzRFuUN.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/xMm4Jw0.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/B3zSgcr.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/MgzulNx.jpg
xj_man_646
02-28-2022, 08:38 AM
Whoa. That doesn't look good!
i didn't read the fine print, the bold print, or even look at the pictures :lol:
so i got the stub kit cuz i thought mine was SUPER blown out, just ordered what was available. turns out my stick was RTV'd to the stick-side stub and that sleeve is super wallowed out. this would be the source of my sloppy, wet noodle feeling shift. after reading up on both styles, i think i'll re-use the bolt-on stub, the stick stub bolted to it, and then weld on a whole new stick bent to perfection for my hand.
https://i.imgur.com/bPZ7zlD.jpg
so i really like this transmission, it's nice n easy to tear down n work on. no special tools, not even a press was needed. all new now and ready for another 337,000 miles. this trans had not been rebuilt before, i was without question breaking the factory sealer for the first time. so either this is a 337,000 miles trans, or some previous owner had a factory new trans swapped in. the PTO covers had obviously been off at some point, but that was it. it also had what looked like 337,000 miles of diesel oil and road grim built on up on it. there has to be 3 clutches worth of friction material built up inside the bell housing! :lol:
and the freaking deer are back :james: i filled the bird feeder and within 10minutes the turkey were there eating everything i spilled. not 5 minutes later and the deer are chasing off the turkey to stick their tongue in the feeder to eat the seed. i mean, COME ON!
https://i.imgur.com/xgrNmVc.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/BYpwIqo.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/jcUIZwx.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/JxFh7II.jpg
xj_man_646
03-04-2022, 09:41 AM
That is the getrag unit right? Not a NV4500 that was swapped in?
Kinda cool that they're so easy to rebuild.
YUP! Getrag G360 basically the same gear spread as a 4500, and the same strength. only thing i can find was that the 4500 being more widely used was cheaper for the 2nd gen trucks. there is ZERO reason to swap to a 4500 that i can tell. just the internet running around yelling about it being amazing! ... cuz swapping a new trans in place of a ragged out something that needs rebuilt will always feel/shift better, thanks captain obvious.
i mean, there were steps that you could have used a press for getting things apart or back together. but when you can just tap things with a tiny 6" handled light hammer, it's just 1000x easier.
So when the cheap PTO cover trans cooler things don't say they are for a G360, I guess they mean it! Nothing a little bit of work from a carbide burr couldn't handle, bolted right up nice after. you also can't use the 3/8 bolts in the kit, the G360 was M10, go figure. seamed like a good plan before hauling heavy since i just rebuilt the trans and needed to change the break-in fluid out anyways.
https://i.imgur.com/zNljR6l.jpg
xj_man_646
04-26-2022, 03:14 PM
What is going to be your first major haul with the truck?
What is going to be your first major haul with the truck?
Towed pretty great! got 11mpg at 70+ with the 9000lb-ish 28ft enclosed. that's what my GMC got empty.
https://i.imgur.com/8pFG0dz.jpg
xj_man_646
04-26-2022, 04:49 PM
Oh, didn't realize the trip was done already. Very nice! Yeah, my '06 got 12-13 on my way home from Phoenix. Oh well! I am not looking at owning another diesel anytime soon...prices are out of control right now :lol:
Cobound
04-26-2022, 06:07 PM
I got 10 mpg in a direct headwind of 25mph...15 mpg when I was cruising in decent weather going 75+
Love this thing - but it's no fullsize :p
https://scontent.ffcm1-2.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/277819361_10100318274653700_774428423040670604_n.j pg?_nc_cat=108&ccb=1-5&_nc_sid=730e14&_nc_ohc=Bb2kVPpUCpIAX8vh0O2&_nc_ht=scontent.ffcm1-2.fna&oh=00_AT_dUe9PSIQXziSrcgw0hEg--8aQDgeRHcSb46BvXYbn1w&oe=626D321C
That Ram is pimp as hell!!!
I got 10 mpg in a direct headwind of 25mph...15 mpg when I was cruising in decent weather going 75+
10mph isnt bad in a headwind for that towing!
We had a 45mph headwind with 60mph gusts for about 3 hours across Idaho...I was getting 6-7mpg, that was nuts. Normally, towing the JK (3K lb trailer, 6K lb JKU) I'm averaging 12.2.
Cobound
04-26-2022, 08:51 PM
Yeah, we got beat down to and from this trip - drove for hours turned left just to go straight. My cruise actually shut down once because the system though my steering was jacked :lol:
That said, that’s on 37s with stock gears, too!
I’m in love with this thing!
i've also been burning like 2 gallons of used oil in this truck every tank. filtered before going in, and makes my trash worth $5.50 a gallon!
xj_man_646
04-27-2022, 09:03 AM
i've also been burning like 2 gallons of used oil in this truck every tank. filtered before going in, and makes my trash worth $5.50 a gallon!
That is the good thing about those old ones...you can get away with that stuff. I think you can even do a higher oil : diesel ratio if you wanted.
That is the good thing about those old ones...you can get away with that stuff. I think you can even do a higher oil : diesel ratio if you wanted.
i've read about guys running 60:40! i don't need to go that crazy, it does smoke more. but after realizing i had over $100 in fuel sitting under my sand blaster i decided to get a filter setup and just get it all out of my way! i'll probably use it slower once i bust thru this pile of jugs so i can keep the lubricity up for every tank and not just after i change oil.
so i got a fryer oil filter set-up, 10" cone filter in a wire support. the support legs sit perfectly on a 5gal bucket, so i just filter into that and use a bucket pump into the truck. i just 3D printed a filter separator as well, so i can filter thru 2 at the same time. i'm only pouring oil that has had time to settle too, so chunks and flecks to the jug bottom. once i see anything chunky or metallic swirl i stop and leave the last 5% of the oil in the jug to throw away.
the oil goes thru the filters slow enough with gravity that it really does a great job cleaning it. the buckets is clean enough that i have no concern over fuel filter clogs at all. the 2nd filter only helped that too. you can see exactly where i pour the oil in cuz it'll be darker from carbon/stuff settling out right there on the filter. the tip will be a little metallic from tiny flecks, but the 2nd filter won't really show anything. takes a modest pour to fill the cone and get enough thru to finally empty a gallon jug, then you just let it sit there for a few minutes to finish.
https://i.imgur.com/Qz2gyks.jpg
Cobound
04-27-2022, 12:42 PM
:eek:
Yeah, I'm not doing that - bonus to you :lol:
:eek:
Yeah, I'm not doing that - bonus to you :lol:
old tech FTW! no way i'd run it in that new fandangled jaz
Where did you find the filters and cone at affordably? I've been using furnace filter material to filter my waste oil.
We hardly drive anymore so we don't generate the oil like we used to. I used to go through a drum of Mobil1 every year, now I don't even buy drums anymore.
Amazon!
50pk filters:
https://smile.amazon.com/dp/B0018OZFTS?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details
filter holder:
https://smile.amazon.com/dp/B00C67J2YA?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details
and i can send ya the separator .stl if interested
so the other day i filtered out a bunch of oil and in the process i put like 2gal in the truck and re-filled the bucket. well i never went to top off the other 20gal of fuel in the tank and was running around on like 20+% used. that did smoke more for sure, and cold starts got slow or wouldn't catch first crank. i'm going to stick to my 10%
xj_man_646
04-28-2022, 10:24 AM
:eek:
Yeah, I'm not doing that - bonus to you :lol:
You definitely wouldn't want to. Your (truthfully, anything newer) diesel is picky.
You definitely wouldn't want to. Your (truthfully, anything newer) diesel is picky.
when I TDI swap this XJ, i'm throwing a mechanical VE pump conversion on it to keep with the old pump theme.
Cobound
04-28-2022, 11:01 AM
Yeah, picky indeed - that said, I definitely love the diesel. Honestly wish I had one sooner.
Sean said years ago, about the time I picked up my first truck, my '13 Ram, that once you had a truck you'll never go back. He was right - went from the Ram to a Gladiator and haven't looked back!!
I'm not sure I could go back to gas now either!! Even w/ all the new doo dads, I'm happy w/ it. I'm keeping it simple, it works - and w/ the Banks stuff, plug n play, even peppier :p
Excited to get out and tow more w/ it, have a trip May 20 w/ my Escapade, Memorial weekend (Shakk) and June (VA) w/ the SXS. See what it does w/o all the headwind :rock:
Baby peez
04-28-2022, 01:12 PM
Nice idea for the spacer
nblehm
04-28-2022, 10:04 PM
I'm not sure I could go back to gas now either!!
wait til you get a repair bill :eek:
xj_man_646
04-29-2022, 11:19 AM
wait til you get a repair bill :eek:
Maybe he will plan to swap these out as warranties expire. :dunno:
Cobound
04-29-2022, 02:34 PM
Warranty - factory and extended.
Nothing is cheap these days, so whatever.
Those filters work disturbingly well when you run two of them, thanks!
Being a cheap bastard, I might just go full granpappy and go back to letting oil settle, filter it, then boil it, then reuse it in my old ****.
right! i've been pretty happy and not worried to dump it in the tank. hell, i'd actually love my fuel filter to get a little build up cuz the non-adjustable electric pump is actually putting out too much PSI :roflmao:
the boil it i wouldn't have expected ... trying to get dissolved water/fuel to evaporate off? after seeing so many of the VW guys sending oil samples for analysis and going 30,000 miles in a TDI before the oil would drop below the "industry standard" ... seams pretty reasonable to run it in a tractor, etc after filtering.
*post moved to correct truck build thread*
xj_man_646
07-13-2022, 01:31 PM
Why is this in your Yodge thread?
Why is this in your Yodge thread?
oops ... moved
on another note however ... i have been collecting Waste Motor Oil from friends, and have been getting a lot. as i got more, i started running more, and I'm up to running about 30% WMO. for my 30gal tank on the truck, i'll put in about 10gal of straight filtered WMO. it does smoke a tad more, but only where the truck is tuned heavy anyways. MPG check pending.
xj_man_646
07-15-2022, 11:13 AM
That's pretty awesome. How does it feel in terms of power? About the same?
The beauty of old diesels :lol:. Trying that on a stock new truck would not end well.
That's pretty awesome. How does it feel in terms of power? About the same?
The beauty of old diesels :lol:. Trying that on a stock new truck would not end well.
RIGHT! i would never do this to a common rail!
it's hard to say for sure exactly how it feels for power because i changed the tune so many times trying to find a sweet spot between smoke and power. with the VE that's a LOT less power lol. even thinking about it, i wouldn't say i noticed any difference in power. the MPG should tell the tale though.
i guess i'll do some catch up here ... after getting new tires, i washed the truck a week later and found that the tires had spun on the wheels! we marked em just out of curiosity. no issues, but it happened. the grease pen marks were lined up with the valve stem.
https://i.imgur.com/gJjmjXG.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/LSQb14s.jpg
restacked the rear D80 limited slip for max friction surfaces, and even added some shims to the load washers. only did 0.0120" per side, but could have used more, it's not crazy tight yet.
https://i.imgur.com/OyxWLrt.jpg
for both the 55 and Hank i got Fluidamr's, and instead of buying the $30 magnet ring for re-timing i 3d printed a template with 2deg resolution. you add a pointer to the front and align it with a mark, set the engine and pump all in factory timing, then turn the engine back a few deg before tightening down the pump gear to get more fuel advance than factory.
also for both, i decided to make my own "AFC Live" in-cab tuner for the mechanical pump. $100 in parts vs the $450 one from PDD, just no fancy box. i do however have flip-out hinges to use under the dash and will make a 3D printed mount.
https://i.imgur.com/PUPjkeX.jpg?1
https://i.imgur.com/TTMHhST.jpg?1
https://i.imgur.com/XxW5cOu.jpg?1
Transmission deal ... the GETRAG is apparently having parts discontinued quickly now. my grinding after rebuild had nothing to do with the clutch, that was all really smooth. it was that the 1 and 2 steel cone for the synchro's were worn in and seated deep enough over the friction cone that they landed on the gear. once the synchro slide landed on the gear, there was zero engagement. since those slides are no longer available new, i added some custom shims under the friction cone that's pined to the gear to increase interference. based on the fit of the friction to the shift cone, i added 0.030" under one side, and 0.045" under the other. got it all back together and she's super smooth! took 20 or so clutches and shifts sitting in the driveway to get them seated and functional, but good to go.
got the Fluidamr installed and it made a huge difference in idle and free-reving, but haven't really driven it yet. my rubber was SHOT. it forced me to space the fan out though, i over did it, and on the first drive the fan eventually ate the radiator when it caught one of the top to bottom wire supports. new AL rad, new lower hose, all sealed up and better fan spacing, but not driven as i started the floor.
the floor rotted from the inside out. outside was clean, basically new undercoated metal ... the inside was DONE. cut out the junk, wire wheel, phenolic acid etch, wire brush and cleanup, sealed the outside of the patch with ChassisSaver, got the patch welded in and the inside coated in ChassisSaver, then seam seal and top coat to finally have my truck back.
https://i.imgur.com/YsktAKW.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/HcMtk7Q.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/spxvmBy.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/xahEm4g.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/jl8C4P4.jpg
xj_man_646
09-20-2022, 09:52 AM
More detail on your in-cab fuel pump adjuster thing please! That sounds interesting!
nblehm
09-20-2022, 10:23 AM
I wish I had your motivation:lol:
so the "tuner" at it's simplest is only a signal retarding device for the boost reference. generally, say, the most power is had with a smokey tune, and you don't want that most of the time ... maybe you have a clean running truck capable of stupid power and just want it to be more tame and drivable day to day ... or at the very least, it gives you a live fine tuning.
the AFC Live:
-bypass switch
-psi regulator
-orifice valve
-psi gauge
basically you tune the screws n springs in the pump for balls out MAX power. when you want that, flip the bypass switch and the pump sees a full and instant boost reference to fuel accordingly. when you want less, you run the "tune". if you have tuned pump fueling beyond max, ignore the bypass and just always run the "tune".
what it does is add a time delay and a max pressure to the boost reference. say you are making 60PSI boost, you can set this so the pump only gets 40psi max. this basically sets your max fueling to equivalent for that 40. save parts, save fuel, "valet mode", or limit smoke because you bought injectors that were too big. but lets also say you get that 60psi by 1800 R's and the throttle becomes overly touchy/violent for day to day use. you can close off the orifice valve more so even if the turbo is supplying 60psi right now, it takes a few seconds for that air to blead thru and takes the pump that much longer to react. say you have slow spooling turbo's, the orifice delay can help give the whirly mufflers time to reach speed before applying that extra fuel.
the gauge just helps you visualize the "tune" to find a setting you like again later.
truck drives WAY better now. the fluidampr made way more difference than i ever thought it would. the whole thing just sounds different, cleaner, let alone running smoother. with the synchro's breaking in more and the shifter pivot screws tight again, the trans works great again. also while in there i replaced all the missing anti-rattle buttons for the SB dual-disk and was worried that would create more clutch sticking, but so far only seams to have eliminated the rattle.
passenger seat mod ... the wife complained about the seat enough that she would search FBM for me looking for junkyard newer seats for a good deal. when putting it back together i noticed there were thick washers on the seat mount from the factory, so i played with em. left the 2 on the front bolts, removed the 2 on the rear bolts (bolts aren't fully threaded, still need them under the bracket then). seat sits way better now, also a highly recommended quick change.
xj_man_646
09-21-2022, 08:57 AM
Ahhh, so it is different than the device I was thinking of. I was thinking of the one that basically moves the fuel plate.
Cobound
09-21-2022, 10:59 AM
JFC - your posts make my garage look like a dumping ground for projects I'll never get to and my energy level non existent :lol:
Dude, I'd drink you out of fridge supply if we were neighbors :roflmao:
:rock:
Ahhh, so it is different than the device I was thinking of. I was thinking of the one that basically moves the fuel plate.
with this set up you delete the fuel plate create virtual limits. this should also do a lot more than just create that upper limit.
JFC - your posts make my garage look like a dumping ground for projects I'll never get to and my energy level non existent :lol:
Dude, I'd drink you out of fridge supply if we were neighbors :roflmao:
:rock:
https://media0.giphy.com/media/zXubYhkWFc9uE/giphy.gif?cid=790b761194247c02ba7d98b22d87a46f9b5c adb4e237e6de&rid=giphy.gif&ct=g
xj_man_646
09-21-2022, 01:47 PM
with this set up you delete the fuel plate create virtual limits. this should also do a lot more than just create that upper limit.
Very interesting. I'm still not sure I understand how it works, but it is neat :lol:
holy crap ... the fluidampr is worth it! it lives up to the marketing and hype. now, my factory balancer was junk to start with, but everything is better. EVERYTHING is better. the engine idles smoother ... runs quieter at idol, at speed, on the throttle ... doesn't sounds like death revving it out when it starts to defuel ... transmission is quieter (i'd like to say shifts better, but i just rebuilt it too).
good enough that i'm pretty sure i'm going to buy one for the VW TDI too
xj_man_646
10-07-2022, 12:24 PM
I would not have guessed that change. Interesting!
factory rubber damper is built for a single RPM and is ok around that RPM. the factory set it somewhere where it thought was a good idea, and somewhere nowhere near where i run the engine. plus mine was dry rotted to **** and probably non-functional at any RPM.
the fluidampr is supposed to work better at the same RPM, but also work at any RPM.
AAAANNNNDDDD ... it's broke ...
tried towing for the 1st time since the re-rebuilt transmission, was supposed to be going to Rausch Creek this weekend. made it 4 miles
as of hitching everything was great except it had popped out of 1st on me, just like 2nd, immediately after rebuild until it boke in. well it popped out a few times HARD with the trailer, and now i can't even hold it in gear or move the truck anywhere with it. BAM, out of gear while i'm still holding the stick IN gear. worst part of it is that now 2nd has no synchro again! WTF!?!? how did i also get instant 2nd synchro death!?! something in that 1-2 shift assembly is FUBAR.
xj_man_646
10-28-2022, 08:46 AM
At least it seemed relatively simple to take apart :dunno:
That sucks. Hate when a trip is cancelled due to vehicular problems.
it's not bad to get out and apart ... but i can't risk this stupid trans again, this truck has to be my long-haul rig.
going to just keep driving it as-is for now, but not towing cuz that's the only time i use 1st. once the XJ is on the road, and i've been able to land an NV5600, i'll have to do the swap this winter.
Friday:
last 2 times the g360 was rebuilt, i wasn't able to find an NV5600 within a reasonable distance and/or price. i actually found and lined up 2 on Friday for Saturday pick up. TWO! i talked to some rebuilders and everything is still available for the 5600, but why not have a spare? they are a pain to find whole and i will have 2 trucks running them.
now i just have to get the whole rig home. i start playing with it in the parking lot and 1st is FUBAR. slightly rolling down hill, just the lightest clutch pressure, it'll roll over a little and pop out. doesn't matter how little load, it won't make 1 full revolution without popping out. something is bent or broken or both in there now ... but the rest was fine. drove home great in 2nd and up.
Saturday:
first one was about 2h away. i picked it up and seams like a great trans, case is just a little crusty on the outside but will clean up nice. dude was great, easy pick-up, done. the 2nd was another 2h drive, but only 3h from home. scheduled 7-8pm pickup after whatever he was doing, i got to a gas station about 6:30 to chill. 8:30 rolls around, no-call, no-show, and i'm driving the 3h back home with only 1 trans. ghosted. next morning he ties to convince me to drive the 6h round trip again. no, gfy.
1st was bare, 2nd was a "swap kit", so i'll keep an eye out for another reasonable bare trans now. i also find it funny that on thrusday i picked up and installed the new re-tubed front drive shaft. now it's gota get longer again.
https://i.imgur.com/bHOqTGj.jpg
Cobound
10-31-2022, 12:09 PM
You have the Three Musketeers of projects :p
You have the Three Musketeers of projects :p
16 cylinders of mechanically injected diesel fury!
Cobound
11-01-2022, 12:56 PM
Let's ride :rock:
while i'm waiting on TDI electronics to come in, i started tinkering with things that didn't take my truck out of commission.
had one front turn signal that the socket went bad, the ground strap broke off so i had to solder on a new one. easy enough. also my TruckLite LEDs were having issues, one wasn't working in low beam. turns out it's the light side connector! :james: easy enough fix though. while in there, they were HORRIBLY adjusted and i ran them back to a way better spot. if on one flashes me i might move them up again too.
next tackled the head liner. wasn't a huge need, but no more foam dusting on me is a huge win. the PO pulled the fabric so it was just the nasty left behind. at least he had good enough sense to leave the backer! just cleaned up the inside a TON seeing the finished surface, and i love the custom look. i have enough material left over to do the soft inserts on the door panels with the same stuff. quilted black vinyl from amazon.
also ordered new black visors, and new black carpet. the shifter hole will move back like 8" with the 6spd, so i'll can just cut it where i need it now. plus clean and not worn. the idea is to make all soft surfaces black, and leave all the plastic trim gray. that means at some point i also need new seats, the wife wishes that was higher on the priority list too.
https://i.imgur.com/wYGJ5jo.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/JFFbW3G.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/kvhZuTH.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/1BKtj7q.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/lb8e4jR.jpg
Cobound
01-03-2023, 11:35 AM
That is F'n sexxxxxy!!!!!
Two headliners in one week, you were busy!!!
getting myself set up for the big winter overhaul. i'm waiting on parts to get the TDI-XJ on the road before i can tear things apart on this truck, should make a huge difference. wish me luck!
NV5600 swap ... it's amazing what a little time and some leftover rattle can can do. aerosol overhaul ftw. i'll clock the np205 down slightly to help the front drive shaft angles. along with the longer trans that should make a HUGE difference up there. i'll have to make a whole new crossmember from scratch to clear everything, but i'm betting i'll still be similar or higher belly. that obviously requires a new clutch, master cyl, starter, and why not a short throw shifter as well. clutch is a dual disk from Valair.
Interior ... the trans requires i cut a new hole for the shifter, so good time for new carpet. i got black to match the headliner, all soft materials will be black and plastic will be factory grey. new black visors, and new seats too. Audi S5 full power/heat in black leather. they are thin enough i believe i can just adapt them right on top of the factory pedestals and maybe even get lower. should add seat adjustments to the passenger side while keeping the factory flip-fwd for rear access. hopefully. while the whole thing is apart, it's also going to get some Lizard Skin sound control sprayed in there too.
Suspension ... the rear leaves have 1" of droop if you jack up the truck by the hitch. it's basically a hard-tale and rides like junk currently. i have 64" '98 GM 1500 3" lift leaves and new hangers for the back. will do a shackle flip and hopefully also eliminate the factory 4" block back there. the trailer load air bags will need re-mounted and more than make up for the load capacity of the lighter spring. along with them, i'll have to re-mount the traction bars down below the axle to keep my mount separation and keep them functional. the front has an issue with the rear eye hitting the frame since the lift spring is longer. i'm going to swap out for a slightly longer shackle, and remove the smallest leaf to soften things up and bring the height back down. once i have a final resting height, i can rework the front hanger if needed for caster/pinion angle or height adjustments.
fuel tank ... while it's under the knife, i'm going to remove the custom aux tank currently where the spare tire should be. i hope to get this back up and functional as either a dual tank, or transfer tank. haven't decided yet.
https://i.imgur.com/9orzsPp.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/JS6WDXP.jpg
Hoofmann
01-13-2023, 01:41 PM
That transmission is huge!
xj_man_646
01-13-2023, 02:35 PM
Make sure to read the fine print on your clutch. PJ went through this with an aftermarket one for his dually recently...apparently they are not spec'd for engine braking, especially with a trailer, and are prone to premature failure.
I was not aware of that, and was definitely surprised by it.
Maybe you're aware of it already, in which case, carry on. Wanted to warn in case you weren't though.
what failed?
i started researching it cuz i hadn't heard that. as usual there's 1001 different guesses and web-driver unalienable rules ... but little actual knowledge.
xj_man_646
01-17-2023, 09:03 AM
From what I understand it wipes out the friction disc(s). They are designed to hold positive torque from the engine, not negative torque from the drivetrain. If I recall correctly its something related to the angle that the friction zones sit at with respect to the flywheel and the intermediate disc.
xj_man_646
01-17-2023, 09:07 AM
More info from PJ
Since the main direction of slip is one way and the trans side is the more resistant to motion, the engine side will grip the flywheel and twist between rest and some angle x.
This angle is kinda like putting your two hands palms together, and twisting one side. Did to friction, springs, and the strength of the clutch it forces the transmission side to follow. Springs help damp the force of twist and other vibrations.
The latter two are what limit the opposite rotation due to the need for overall clutch rigidity and strength to handle the HP/TQ of the application
Parts/components and the connection can’t be too small to allow for the same level of rotation in the opposite direction.
The opposite direction is possible, but at a limited angle. Once you push through this angle range, you’re basically transmitting all power and load into the clutch backwards with no spring damping due to coil bind or your resting the two halves on it.
Which is bad and ruins the springs, clutch housing, etc.
that sounds ridiculous ... the flywheel and mid plate are solid, the clutch frictions/rivets are all symmetrical. none of that cares what direction the torque happens in. even the disc hub springs can be symmetrical (maybe designed to not be?) ... the only part not is the helical cut of the transmission gears.
i read lots of ppl say that engine braking with a heavy loads is fine, but downshifting and letting the transmission speed up the engine is CATESTROPHIC TORTURE. both are the same torque direction! the engine is freewheeling if the trans is spinning it up, that's basically no load so the only possible difference are torque harmonics. maybe that bounces in the clutch vs a heavy load staying tight? or are they talking about downshifting while the engine brake is engaged? but again, if the hub springs are symmetrical, that's no difference that slipping the clutch with your foot on the throttle to accelerate.
the other big change from a factory to aftermarket is ditching the dual mass flywheel on newer trucks. i guess the g56 has much more of an issue with this, and why it received the dual mass from the factory.
i'm going to keep reading on it, but so far i get the vibe that the aftermarket included a line in their fine print to limit liability and the zealots took it as gospel with internet fueled terror.
xj_man_646
01-17-2023, 11:51 AM
I thought the friction plates are directional / not reversible? Wouldn't that indicate that there might be something to it?
Is it me or does a website for Valair itself straight up not exist? It would be worth a call to their tech line or something.
I thought the friction plates are directional / not reversible? Wouldn't that indicate that there might be something to it?
Is it me or does a website for Valair itself straight up not exist? It would be worth a call to their tech line or something.
we are both well into guessing at this point too ... there's not just info and a LOT of web-mechanics.
i'll agree it's worth a call to valair and SB to get their actual take, but neither present anything i can find on the subject. leads me to believe it's less of an issue.
xj_man_646
01-17-2023, 12:42 PM
Do you have the clutch already? If it isn't mentioned in their warranty or instructional documentation then I'd agree.
South Bend's official answer:
Is it ok to use my clutch as a brake?
What you are talking about is the age-old practice of downshifting. Even though we all learned that downshifting is an acceptable way to slow down, it does put unnecessary wear on the clutch . If a person is in the habit of driving this way, they will wear out the drive surfaces of their clutch well before they should. A little known fact is that a clutch is designed to torque in one direction only. When you downshift, you send a reverse thrust through the drive train, which causes the dampening portion of the clutch disc to torque in the wrong direction. This will accelerate the wear of the clutch.
basically it's easier to change the brakes, use them.
i can't see engine braking and downshifting being any different on the 'damping portion'
only referance i can find from Valair in their entire install, faq, Do/Don't info.
Break-In Periods
One of the most asked questions we get is about Clutch Break-In, the break-in period is the
most critical period for a new clutch, we suggest low power levels with a lot of stop and go
driving while taking off in 1st or L, basically the more times you engage and disengage the
clutch within this period the better it will be, 200 miles of city driving where you are using the
clutch frequently is much better than 200 miles of highway where you may only use the clutch
once or twice. Turn off exhaust brakes and do not use the clutch/transmission to slow the
truck down during the break in period.
i did see on the SB info where they said it might be more difficult to get into gear because the dual discs are 3x heavier than the factory clutch. synchro's have to work WAY harder. good reason to minimize synchro use with less shifts or rev matching ... also many many DEMAND any diesel manual be driven that way like it's a commandment.
thou shalt carry a 17mm box wrench
thou shalt learn to drive non-synchronized transmissions and rev match or else thou arest thine douche-nozel
so i got to thinking the other day about my low end power issue ... it might not just be from super lag turbo's. i really need to verify where they set the timing, and with the rest of the build being very dyno number oriented, i bet it's way too high.
xj_man_646
01-17-2023, 04:35 PM
Now, the question would be how does that info above compare to an OEM clutch and the recommendations in an owner's manual? :dunno:. Genuinely curious as I've seen OEM clutches last a long time.
I can't see ever wanting to haul a loaded trailer without engine braking, especially on hills. Eff that noise.
xj_man_646
01-17-2023, 04:38 PM
so i got to thinking the other day about my low end power issue ... it might not just be from super lag turbo's. i really need to verify where they set the timing, and with the rest of the build being very dyno number oriented, i bet it's way too high.
What is your experience with a 12v?
They are gutless in OEM form.
I can't imagine how they would be before turbo spool in a compound application. Are both your turbos larger than the stock 12v unit?
Baby peez
01-24-2023, 08:46 AM
I can't see ever wanting to haul a loaded trailer without engine braking, especially on hills. Eff that noise.
yup, at that point a big block gasser is starting to be in consideration
ya know ... i was thinking the same and was somewhat worried about that. i actually have an exhaust brake on my bench that i got for the 55, but will be installing on Hank eventually. i've not towed a ton, but multiple trips with the enclosed loaded with the YJ and i've never thought i was anywhere near the edge without one. PA turnpike mountains, up n down the goat paths getting to the trails, all reasonable. the enclosed does have pretty good brakes though.
nblehm
01-26-2023, 08:15 AM
I’ve had a bad experience with Valair (Sp?) clutches. We put one in a customer truck, they picked the dual disc performance clutch. He used it to tow trailers etc and it sucked there was zero clutch slip, just grab and go. We swapped it out for there daily driver dual disc and while it was better it still wasn’t something I’d want in a truck that I pulled a trailer with. That is my only experience with them and it was a bad one with wrong parts selected so take it with a grain of salt.
yeah, lots of ppl can't deal with a tight clutch. i think it's weird that Valair specs the towing or daily dual disc for even an otherwise stock truck when towing, just not enough torque to slip it. on the other hand, i love a tight clutch and everything i own gets a ceramic puck set up. hank with 10,000lbs in tow can easily make RPM thru the current SB daily dual while letting it out. preference vs horse-torques vs driver preference
it has begun! G360 is out, i am now on the "always swap it out" bandwagon. sure it can be fixed, but parts aren't available any more. she's being sold for parts if anyone wants it. check out the breakage though, how do you explode a synchro collar!?!? that would explain why i suddenly had zero synchro in 2nd :james: only thing i can figure is it was damaged when the rear input bearing exploded and i missed the cracks. would also explain the non-engagement in the 1st rebuild.
i was going to give my buddy the clutch since it was a SB dual disc with life left on the frictions ... but it would seam that's not really going to work. the dampers are old enough they have become brittle and are shattering. one is completely missing from the other disc. the hot spots have also been there long enough to be smooth :LOL:
https://i.imgur.com/LpbCs4r.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/eeAV7By.jpg
so into the actual 5600 swap. after riding with a buddy who had a 5600 truck, I'm starting to get excited for this.
first things first, new engine mounts to make sure the engine is in the right place before i build a trans mount. obviously needed anyways though, engine picked up almost 1/2". while things were apart i also did a rear main seal.
got the 2ng gen trans adapter on there easy enough, but the 2nd gen starter does hit the frame. now i have the back of the engine jacked up n held higher at the moment, but I'm pretty sure I'll need to add some clearance in there. new Valair street dual disc, everything about it just seams better than the SB. design, not old vs new.
didn't get a picture, but beat the pinch seam up flat to the body for bell clearance.
i was pretty sure the 5600 was longer from my research, but it's not all that different. also excited to be able to use the clocking ring now that I'm making a crossmember and get the front shaft angles way better. i bet the bell height is still the same or better :LOL:
nv5600 vs G360:
(from bell housing, just realizing i didn't measure the trans adapter thickness)
-5.5" longer with clocking ring (5-1/8" longer without)
-shifter is only 2.25" further back
*EDIT: trans adapters ... 1.125" longer for the 2nd gen. (2nd Gen: 2-3/8" ; 1st Gen: 1-1/4")
so this means my t-case actually moves back 6-5/8". The shifter moves back 3-3/8"
https://i.imgur.com/wJPkDhn.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/GdBWYHF.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/1WSBHnj.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/SVqsY3V.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/OhYupsI.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/M08zO1k.jpg
xj_man_646
02-23-2023, 11:58 AM
Nice progress so far. What do you have for a trans jack?
right now i have a HF trans jack adapter welded onto an old floor jack ... but i'm seriously considering getting a new HF wide base jack for this heavy beast.
Hoofmann
02-23-2023, 05:50 PM
I’d say this is the transmission that should be in a 12 valve with compound turbos. I wouldn’t trust anything besides an NV5600 or a ZF6. I guess the NV4500 would work, but that pesky 5th gear issue is just a bummer.
xj_man_646
02-24-2023, 09:10 AM
I wish the ZF-6 would have been used across the board. Its very rare that I hear about any issues with that transmission.
Until this thread I honestly didn't know you could still get parts for the NV5600. It went out of use (in the Dodge trucks anyway) 20 years ago!
[QUOTE=Hoofmann;83743]Id say this is the transmission that should be in a 12 valve with compound turbos. I wouldn
Id say this is the transmission that should be in a 12 valve with compound turbos. I wouldnt trust anything besides an NV5600 or a ZF6. I guess the NV4500 would work, but that pesky 5th gear issue is just a bummer.
the 4500 and the G360 that just came out are basically equal in strength, Dodge only switched cuz the 4500 is cheaper to make. the 4500 however still has all the parts to buy.
and the 5th gear nut is an easy fix with the locks available now.
I wish the ZF-6 would have been used across the board. Its very rare that I hear about any issues with that transmission.
Until this thread I honestly didn't know you could still get parts for the NV5600. It went out of use (in the Dodge trucks anyway) 20 years ago!
agreed, i think the ZF6 would be just a TINY bit better of a trans than the 5600.
there are lots of guys who use the 5600 for crazy power applications cuz the aluminum case of the G56 deflects too much. They even sell an exoskeleton stiffener!
http://lazarsmith.com/sitebuilder/images/G56TorKage-308x495.jpg
no clue why, but it's the ' that makes the quotes fail ... i had to change "I'd" to Id and wouldn't to wouldnt in the quote before it would work.
so trans adapters ... 1.125" longer for the 2nd gen.
2nd Gen: 2-3/8"
1st Gen: 1-1/4"
so this means my t-case actually moves back 6-5/8"
The shifter moves back 3-3/8"
first things things first, making the NP205 bolt to the NV5600. most ppl just remove the rear seal from the 5600 and let the void between trans and t-case fill with fluid. we can do better.
i put a rag over the 205 input and tapped the input collar over it to hold steady. then had the wife run the 205 output with a drill so that i could grind the end of the collar to 2.0" like a fancy little lathe. polished it a bit, and she slips right in.
my only concern is the striations from the grinder that are still there after polishing are going the wrong direction to wipe fluid back into the case. they might actually pull fluid thru the seal. i guess we'll find out, and i can have a machinist do the other side of the collar if needed.
https://i.imgur.com/SPlV19W.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/nfLPCKb.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/TTJhl1P.jpg
next i got distracted and made a shift knob adapter. M10x1.5 to 1/2-13. this puts the EATON shifter on my 5600 short-shift stick, and gives me 2 air switches on the knob. one is for exhaust brake for sure, but not sure on the 2nd. front locker? air horn?
https://i.imgur.com/J24GK70.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/8I2yA3e.jpg
now onto the good stuff! first trans stab complete and it looks like everything is going to fit really nice! new trans jack from HF is also really good. dual axis tilt on the head, goes higher and lower than my welded junk i had been using, nice stable base, the damn thing even weighs more than the 5spd did. all win. plus now i can cut the adapter off the other and have a standard floor jack back.
started by finding the CG of the 5600/205 for best placement on the jack. worked out nice at the seam in the rear case. made manipulation under the truck way easier having that set middle of the jack pad. plus now i can pull/stab it all together and not have to pull the 205 under the truck. that thing is heavy enough to require the trans jack by itself. hell, i can even leave the t-case shifters on while pulling it now.
before the stabbing i started a base for the 205 twin stick shifters, just waiting on the shifter kit to start modifying those parts onto my bracket. was expected Friday, but it appears to be lost now ... at least i could finish the rest easy enough in the truck while this bracket really needed done on the bench.
LIFT YOUR TRUCK! cuz then you can slid the trans under without jacking it up :lol:
https://i.imgur.com/V2FBVRI.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/qhzHiIm.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/tzlKvLY.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/gl3u5Eu.jpg
xj_man_646
02-27-2023, 09:24 AM
Nice work!
2 steps fwd n one step back ... never fails.
got the tunnel and floor sealed/cut last night, that went well. i decided there was no reason to go too crazy and throw sparks under the dash, so i made the tunnel patch semi-permanent and removable. could go back to the factory trans easier/ patch was easier / it's sealed in place and the new carpet will make it look pretty.
then the NP205. the single stick running 2 shift rails deal wasn't good when new, let alone after 30 years. if i'm making a custom shifter for the 5600, it's going to be a twin stick, if it's a twin stick it has to be capable of FWD. easy enough, just pop out the main shift rail and grind out for the interlocks. sure enough i now have FWD-high, and FWD-low! :rock:
i also now have rear-high and fwd-low at the same time :james: ... and since it's the direction that a passenger could just kick one stick one notch and get there, i'm going to have to re-pull the stick and add some metal back. oh well.
https://i.imgur.com/lGOjoM5.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/iXrJ7Vd.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/k4CqUKR.jpg
fixed it! no more NP205 cross ratio! mod all the 205's though, that only took me 35min to pull the rail, weld, re-grind, and totally reassemble/test.
twin stick kit should be here today, hoping the lateness wasn't cuz UPS destroyed the box and it's missing parts ...
https://i.imgur.com/pCPSR71.jpg
xj_man_646
03-01-2023, 09:44 AM
Twin sticks in the tow pig. That is sweet :pimp:.
twin sticks complete and functional! not only that, they fit thru the hole ever so nicely.
started with a GM shifter kit from JB Custom Fabrications and started cutting them up. crazy enough the offset was too much and i had to section 1-1/4" out (1-3/8" on the angle) to get the center of the sticks 7" from the center of the 5600 shifter. 1/4" plate and angle mount bolted to the trans was good spacing, but better with the little spacer that came in the kit. the fwd boss already had a thru-hole and i just tapped the angle for the bolt, while the rearward boss needed to be drilled and tapped. i drilled and tapped the center of that boss, and the shifter pivot is 2" up from that rear bolt, and 2-5/8" forward of it.
the shifter connectors aren't as nice as i wanted, but i can fix them later. instead of buying new heims or threaded sleeves and such, i welded a bolt to one end of a 5/16" rod for the female heims to adjust, while i just welded the male heims right to the rod. if i ever need to replace a heim I'll redo them better ... till then this was all i had laying around. i moved the mounting hole in the bottom of the shifters for better misalignment clearance and i didn't need the extra length like the GM kit required.
the adapters bolted to the 205 shift rails are swapped from what the GM application called for. the one on the fwd stick is unmodified while the other i had to cut the sleeve shorter and drill a new hole for the bolt thru the rail. real happy how those came out, and were easy.
i now have the transmission bolted into the truck for good! while still missing the crossmember, i had to see how the shifters felt. this is a short-throw shifter with a factory 3rd gen stick screwed to it and the EATON shift knob. pictured is 2nd gear, talk about an easier reach than the factory setup! depending on how you hold the shifter you can hit your hand on the steering wheel in the 1-2 shift, but I'm going to drive it before i start modifying that.
i think the t-case shifter hole is good to go, the new twin boot covers and seals it great. i MIGHT have gotten the 5600 shifter hole a little small :lol:
https://i.imgur.com/up9TRvP.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/Hn80xn3.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/NLlkfoz.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/URBsIIG.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/djXCIhg.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/AIda7zv.jpg
wow, decent weekend of work! wife actually left me alone and i was productive.
finished getting a lot of little things like the trans adapter covers, starter bolted in, clutch master on, etc. shoot, i had already converted my g360 slave cyl to use a braided stainless -3an hose (very worth it) so i just tossed the 5600 slave on that line. low and behold it was too short :james: had a 36" line in the truck, needed a 48". set about searching thru my "inventory" (the parts hord) and found a 48! :rock: hooked up, re-bled, much win.
cut down the rear DS and ended up with this stubby thing, not impressed but will function. the carrier is even basically trashed but together. i have about 68" yoke to yoke, so when i re-do the rear suspension later this spring I'll get a new 1pc shaft for back there.
you ever paint stuff and keep working hoping it'll be dry by the time you need them? doesn't always work ... almost as bad as forgetting to power wash the fluid film off before major work and cleaning eeeevvverything.
cross member came out nicer and easier than i ever thought it would. i was finishing up taking all my measurements to go CAD up a nice custom tube cross member, when i looked at the factory unit, had to at least see how it lined up. well after the g360 riser had been un-riveted, it slid in there against the frame without hitting anything, no other modification! even the clocked down np205 was still above it! in order to clear the front shaft, the crossmember is about 9.5" back while the t-case only moved just over 6" back. by moving the factory 5600 trans mount back by 1.25" on it's trans plate, i got the mount centered on the crossmember even. the new 4" c-channel riser is 1-1/8" tall.
my front drive shaft was 19deg different from the pinion before this, now it's only 9. should be WAY less chatter with the hubs locked now. hopefully i can make that a few deg better this spring when i mess with the front suspension too.
the twin stick feels AMAZING to shift in the truck. 10,000x more positive feel and smoother than the wallered out factory BS. highly recommended. no more trying to find what feels like half a detent move between 2wd and 4wd high.
https://i.imgur.com/RxcTlhX.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/xtEXg5F.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/OxGM876.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/rlb5m4N.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/mtREnoL.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/yKGK14p.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/I5PjYSD.jpg
last night started out pretty satisfying, the shifters are all in and ready to drive!
the factory boot might not be the ideal, but i think it's going to work good. the square shifter of the 5600 doesn't fit as well in the round boot though. first thing was to cut out the inner boot since the shifter sticks up much further thru the floor. actually fixed most of my ripped boot issue. then since i got the short throw shifter it uses this 1" spacer for the longer stick below the pivot. to gain some clearance for shakin back n forth i had to round the corners more. 2 cut, 2 aren't in the pictures for demo, but i did all 4. shoved it on the tower, marked my hole locations, and made a template to mark out what i could cut and still seal. i actually forgot to grab a picture of the final clearance, but we should be ok.
might shorten or re-bend the shifter later after driving we'll see, but the twin sticks are just awesome to shift thru.
https://i.imgur.com/oj1AlMT.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/g7yZttr.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/weLjTjK.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/cX8Qv3f.jpg
after the shifters i started in on the exhaust. since it was apart i just can't leave well enough alone!
almost a complete re-do of the down pipe, then adding in a BD Diesel exhaust brake and FTE resonator before the t-case. still have some tweaks to make tonight before i burn it all home, but it's all guna fit!
https://i.imgur.com/0ehow85.jpg
xj_man_646
03-08-2023, 09:09 AM
Exhaust brakes are sweet :pimp:
i drove it!! holy sh!t it's better!
got the exhaust welded, painted, and installed back to the t-case and couldn't wait any longer, i had to test drive it. worth it. even with it dumping right under the passenger seat up in the frame, it's quieter. that FTE muffler/resonator thing is really good. i'll finish out the exhaust tonight and be done with this conversion.
new clutch feels 1000x better, i just need to adjust my pedal down to make sure i don't over travel this thing. Chinese short throw shifter is a little sloppy but ok, i might take it apart some time to see if i can tighten it up. no vibrations at all, trans is way quieter, and every synchro works.
i guess i need basically a full tank of fuel city driving to break in the clutch before i start playing games or towing. debating if i do that now or start into something else on it first.
- front suspension recombobulation
- rear suspension re-do from scratch
- floor clean/seal/sound deadener + new carpet
- new seat mounts ... wire new seats
- 1000 other little things
xj_man_646
03-09-2023, 07:35 AM
What are the details on what the suspension needs?
I do recall when I test drove a 1st gen Cummins, the thing rode like a damn hay wagon.
yeah, factory they are known for being the worst riding of the era ... mine however has the stiffest aftermarket lift spring available and is basically a hard tail. if i jack it up by the hitch, the rear axle has maybe 1" of droop, and that includes bushing slop. it's just wrong. i'm pretty sure the PO wrapped up the rear springs doing torque stuff and thought these would help, then added traction bars anyways.
currently i have the 4" spring and the factory 4" block, the factory rear spring is 54". i bought 1998 GMC 1500 3" lift springs that are 64" long. while having to relocate both front and rear spring hangers, i'll do a shackle flip as well. the GMC lift spring should actually be more like a 6" lift for this truck, so with the shackle flip i will get to ditch the block. just lots more betterer. most of my miles are unloaded so this setup should ride/flex WAY better, then i have airride load bags for towing capacity. i'll also have to re-mount the traction bars well under the axle to keep my "link separation"
the front is just a whole lot of tweaking. front shackle is super short factory, so the 6" lift spring is longer to keep that from being inverted. under a good bump the spring eye actually hits the frame (infinite spring rate FTL). longer shackle, easy enough. however this points the pinion down and adds more lift. so i plan to remove the shortest leaf and add 2deg shims. with any luck i'll end up about 1/2deg up more on the pinon and about 1/2" lower ride in the front, all with a softer spring that won't bottom on the frame any more. all that would also help my front DS angles that already got way better with the trans swap.
i need to do the front first so i can set the rear height where i want to match it best. just in case i drop like 1-2" taking out a mid spring or something. TBD
while in the front i'll also re-do the steering stops to maximize turning. that might require some clearance on the shaft yokes, and maybe re-drilling the TRE hole in the high steer arm. you know, just little things ... :lol:
https://media1.giphy.com/media/v1.Y2lkPTc5MGI3NjExM2FhMGM3M2JiZDcwZjg1N2ZmMWJjNGE 3M2Q0OWE3YjQzZWEwNmVkMCZjdD1n/Pja2X9HxQVqVoXx8hc/giphy.gif
holy crap on a cracker, it's not even the same truck any more. i didn't even have time to notice the ride cuz i already had to shift again :lol: seriously though, there is stuff i never expected to change that's just better. like it smokes way less daily driving it now, i just don't have to lug into turbo lag. i can even turn up the fuel more if i wanted.
less lag, sh!t is faster
more fuel for the smoke, sh!t is faster
better gear splits, sh!t is faster
smother faster shifting, sh!t is faster
no more front drive shaft rattle, t-case is quieter
new spline coupler on the 205 input, t-case is quieter
new twin sticks don't rattle, t-case is quieter
entire transmission is just quieter, there's basically no gear noise
FTE resonator made the exhaust HUGELY quieter inside, but still sounds great outside.
clutch mid-plate does make more noise when released ... i didn't get the quite one, should have paid the extra
new engine mounts with the new trans mount smoothed it out
new clutch that isn't coming apart smoothed it out
alignment in the rear DS apparently was needed to smooth it out
no more front shaft vibes
PLUS! i can get it into 2nd from a stop without putting it in 3rd first. i can put it into any gear i want without grinding. just don't miss 5th n hit reverse, that makes some noise.
it rev's smoother and better even while riding the governor, even more reason for less turbo lag, it's just smoother and quieter and more proper in every metric and every area. it's crazy, i still don't believe it, but i'm freakin thilled. i don't even have carpet or floor insulation in there yet, it's still bare steel! i just bought 2 gal of lizard skin to spray it all down with and new carpet with extra heavy bat.
motivation is HIGH to knock out more of the list to really keep dialing this truck in.
Hoofmann
03-10-2023, 01:28 PM
I remember the getrag in my old first gen was a noisy, finicky bitch. The 5600 is much more refined.
well fukk ...
below picture was a clean dry floor, truck driven 1hour on the highway and parked there. we'll call it excessive ...
1) the hand-ground seal surface for the np205 coupler is 100% not functional. i think i got it a tad small, probably not perfectly round, and i know the striations were going the wrong direction so probably pumping fluid out. i thought maybe worst case it would be a slow enough leak that it would just keep the truck from rusting, but no ... i'm going to have to pull the seal and glue the t-case on like most suggest. i might have a machinist buddy machine the opposite end of the coupler, but i might not be patient enough for that.
2) Rear Main Seal ... nothing more fun than doing preventative maintenance and replacing a non-leaking seal with a bad leaker. turns out, most likely installation error! i hadn't seen the specific Cummins instructions before and just installed it like a normal seal by making sure everything was well oiled. turns out the seal has some Teflon transfer or break-in period and requires a 100% oil free crank to work. oiled, will never seal, time to pull the transmission ... AGAIN
https://i.imgur.com/6xo4rmW.jpg
xj_man_646
03-16-2023, 09:13 AM
I wonder if it is that (reason you mentioned) is why there are so many leaky rear main seals on Cummins engines. That sucks!
driving the truck around til the new seals show up, and i love it. the 6spd was worth every cent and all the work. now i really want to get the interior finished up and the suspension smoothed out!
built a new WMO set up last week. hose is nice n secure on the barrel for wheeling it around, and the air-over pump is awesome. little meter on the handle to know how much i put in, and no more filling jugs! the pump and hose came from a local auction site too, so they were super cheap.
then started stripping the door panels to re-cover them with the headliner material. one piece was proper, but why was the carpet hot glued and stapled on!?!? both will be christmas tree installed.
https://i.imgur.com/zf9UNLW.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/BdxdSKu.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/0ZlZGpb.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/hVA98ft.jpg
minor freak-out today ... i'm going nutz!
last night i got the 205 all glued up, even installed a housing drain plug for that void. new rear main installed DRY, but was a little bit notchy at the transition from the install tool to the crank surface and my automotive-ocd is pulling out my hair wondering if it is straight or has a folded under lip. clutch is all back on with the starter ... i just want to break it in before installing the transmission to find out :cry:
my exhaust was also kind of coming apart when i got under there to start, so i need to redo a bit while the trans is out of the way. while in there i also got a picture i forgot to take, how i beat the pinch seam up against the floor for bell clearance.
https://i.imgur.com/YJPE0RR.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/yww3iCN.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/mkSocEm.jpg
it's all back together, new rear main seal in place! got it together Friday evening right after work and went to town to pick up dinner for the wife n i. about 15 miles, stop n go, plus idling 3 laps around the damn Chick-fil-a building ... after dinner was able to confirm that i made the seal worse! but further confirmed that i freaking love driving the 5600 in this truck. worth every penny and the extra work.
got to talking with a buddy and realized that the PO had put a crank wear sleeve on my engine. big question, is a wear sleeve seal different than standard for the extra dia!?! also, the standard installation tool doesn't quite reach the sleeve and i had to bump it past "the ditch" between. figure there's a decent chance it folded under at that. i've been pulling the crank housing to do this (i won't ever do that again once this is totally fixed) but there's a chance that the oil pan and gasket recombobulation biased the housing up as well. SO ... i have to pull the oil pan this time to be sure, and that requires lifting the freakin engine off the mounts.
https://media.tenor.com/p5EophHk1ksAAAAd/drawing-board-back-to-the-drawing-board.gif
xj_man_646
03-27-2023, 11:08 AM
Hmmmm sounds very fun :lol:.
Sucks, but you'll sort it out and then you'll have a very desirable truck on your hands.
nblehm
03-27-2023, 07:02 PM
Don’t the 5.9s have a cam plug that can also leak? Feel like I have repaired that before
big thing with the cam plug is if you try and tap on the cam/gear for removal or install, you can punch that plug out the back of the motor!
so the fancy little tool kit from amazon showed up Friday and was actually really good. better have been for the money. decided not to pull the pan, and it looks like i got the sealed up quite well!
removing the old wear sleeve turned out to be a non-issue. the CAT chisel trick was right on. nice sharp chisel and beat a line across the sleeve without cutting it, expands it. do 2 or 3 lines and it slid right off by hand. actual no-fuss job. my crank turned out to have one hell of a groove in it, so a new sleeve was 100% necessary.
installing the seal with the sleeve in it to the housing was a little sketch though. keeping the sleeve from falling out, keeping everything from getting dirty or oiled or anything from the rest of the shop, etc. then not touching it while trying to RTV the seal surfaces and get the gasket stuck was also a trick. but then installing the housing/seal together on the engine with the tool was surprisingly slick.
for the oil pan seal, this is what i did ... in order to make sure the oil pan seal didn't bias the main seal at all, i cut the paper gasket out entirely. make sure you don't press down too hard on the pan or you'll start ot break the seal pan-to-block and she might leak later. i brake cleaned everything VERY well (without getting any in the pan), then primed the oil pan surface and the bottom of the seal housing with RTV. just a super thin layer to totally cover the entire surface, and a few globs in the corners at the block. i didn't do this, but nest time i would put a small line of RTV along the back side of the pan rail behind the holes for the housing to draw into/past. the primed surface should make it stick really well. i then installed the seal/housing and tightened the bolts to the block to make sure the seal was perfectly centered. once it wasn't going anywhere, i packed RTV between the pan/housing like i was packing bearings. that work better than i thought cuz it started to come out the bolt holes. at this point i left it for 24hours with the pan bolts only just touching, not even fully finger tight. this would give the RTV a chance to cure thick and be crushed by the pan bolts later to hopefully expand and seal better. (the package even recommended this) sure enough, it sealed up great! but had to RTV the head of the bolts since i didn't get any behind them.
no chances this time, got the flywheel on and started that junk to run in my garage for an hour while i worked on other stuff. i tried to rev it up some here and there as i would walk past to keep things changing. 1h dry and back together she went ... again.
vid: https://i.imgur.com/5I1bRwU.mp4
https://i.imgur.com/xJoUTBi.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/95h5zSa.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/YdL5nfT.jpg
side note:
the NP205 input housing drain was clutch for not making a mess coming back apart. the crossmember has to be out of the way, but easy enough.
while the RTV was cuing so i could torque the pan bolts, i started getting the door cards reupholstered. went out Sunday and was able to get them finished up. it's crazy, i already have a hard time picturing the factory bits.
pealed the carpet off the upper cardboard and just used the lower carpet as a stencil on some leftover floor underlayment. trimmed/sanded to fit, and used some tinny tech screws instead of the Christmas tree clips cuz i just hate those things.
the PO installed a "nice" (now just old-ish) set of 6x9s and they were pushing out on the plastic grill in the door card, one was slightly broken. well enough of that junk, cut those grills out completely.
used spray on headliner/fabric glue to attach the material. that stuff is on there. by the last one i had a pretty good cut pattern to eliminate too much extra bunching and allow the corners to be folded in nice. i folded the corners first, then the sides. hard to see in the pic, but the inside corners i did 3 cuts making 2 little pie shapes in there. glued all the faces to a full sheet, then cut them all out and slowly started to trim before spraying the back down with glue again and starting the folding. have to give the glue time to tack up (30sec to 15min work time) so i would spray one, trim one, fold one, spray one, trim one, etc.
the wife had some e-6000 fabric glue, for the middle cover. she actually came out and helped thru a lot of the process from sanding edges for fit, to gluing everything up. the speaker mesh is just flat glued to the back, then the ridge on the door card then stretches it nice into the opening.
next up ... seal the floors, lizard skin sound control, new carpet, new seats.
https://i.imgur.com/cH3Emrb.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/GLf8FBc.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/2Imbs1U.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/QtqW1YK.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/YdbA8Nr.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/ZZDXNdD.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/zGy9QoR.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/NMHjoK5.jpg
xj_man_646
04-04-2023, 08:49 AM
That's looking really good. You're going to have an awesome truck when all is said and done.
man, felt so good to have the door cards back on and and this rear main saga behind me. confirmed she's doing great ... so i tore it apart again!
with the nice doors, the wife started hounding me to finish the floor n seats too. need to seal the surface rust, i'm a chassis saver guy for that. then 2gal of lizard skin to spray down with new carpet. to top it all off, new seat belts and some used Audi S5 seats for full power/heat and complete the transition to all black soft materials. all plastics will stay the factory grey.
oh the up-side though, i'm pretty happy with no metal work and "minimal" surface rust for a 30yr old truck. outside the pass floor i already fixed last year.
https://i.imgur.com/YpW9INr.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/6oj3HPM.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/B0aic1U.jpg
xj_man_646
04-05-2023, 08:52 AM
Are you buying pre-fit carpet for it or doing it from scratch?
bought a cab specific pre-formed/cut kit. hopefully it's just cutting the shifter hole, bolt holes, and screwing the trim back down.
xj_man_646
04-05-2023, 01:25 PM
That's what I would assume. Nice! Give any thought to a Vinyl floor vs carpet? Just curious.
nope, its a carpet kinda truck. if not id have just left the painted lizard skin. plus extra sound control.
whole kit was only like $180 with extra weighted backing
got the fixed drivers seat mount together before starting on the tilting passenger seat mounts. i used the factory floor hinge for the tilt, then it worked so well i have ordered a new hinge to make the drivers site tilt too. the seats are from a 2-door car, so they have a great latch to fold the back forward built in. will be 1000x easier to access tools n BS behind the seat if both tilt!
so the seat belt doesn't have to hold the occupant and the seat from tilting, i ordered some bear claw latches from Amazon. hopefully easy enough of an install, we'll see.
https://i.imgur.com/uaC0Nj0.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/zrpP9Su.jpg
Cobound
04-13-2023, 10:40 AM
Holy baby Jesus, this is so bad ass.
Family affair, nice work!!! :rock:
xj_man_646
04-14-2023, 10:24 AM
Yeah that is pretty cool
been grinding away at it, slower than i would like. got the Audi seat mounts built up and they came out pretty nice. the driver's tilt's up now, tool access FTW. i have not made latches yet.
got all the rusty bits ground n sealed really well, hopefully won't need to mess with the floor again for a long time. i even found a crack in the rear wall above the drivers rear body mount i had to weld. that was unexpected.
sanded everything good, taped it up (i hate taping/masking) and got the LizardSkin sound control sprayed. 2gal total. i sprayed it all with the full thickness, let i dry for 24h, then came back and finished off the 2gal by doing a second full depth on the back wall, tunnel, and foot wells. messing with it once before i tried this dual coat and got awesome results, it made a huge difference in sound control.
https://i.imgur.com/78jmw9U.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/Vlz9hxD.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/lUiDd7j.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/LKMOFWV.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/M5n7gja.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/8sSWhQj.jpg
xj_man_646
04-17-2023, 12:27 PM
The lizard skin looks really good. Gives a very nice finished look to all the work you've done!
i'm excited, it makes such a HUGE difference in the sound just tapping on the cab. no ring at all, just a dull thud. should be real noticeable on the street.
the texture came out nice and even, i took special care on the back wall since it'll be exposed. factory had carpet glued to the back and side walls, but the new carpet kit only has the floor. the exposed will get sprayed black to match.
ceiling got some stick-on sound mat, my first time using it. stuff made a big difference in the tap test, we'll see how it is on the road. was a pain in the junk rolling it out over head though.
the exposed LizardSkin got painted black to match the new carpet since that kit didn't come with back wall pieces. i kind of wish i had bought flat vs semi-gloss, but not enough to change it. :lol:
https://i.imgur.com/hZGUcuv.jpg
xj_man_646
04-18-2023, 12:00 PM
What do they call that light that you have hanging through the interior?
What do they call that light that you have hanging through the interior?
cordless hood light. now the #1 most used work light i have by far.
https://www.dewalt.com/product/dcl045b/12v20v-max-cordless-hood-light
if you check out the Amazon listing, there's a jeep in one of the pictures. totally my buddies jeep i helped him build :rock:
https://www.amazon.com/DEWALT-DCL045B-Cordless-Hood-Light/dp/B09DRDZF75
https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/71MKSHJNY1L._AC_SX679_.jpg
Cobound
04-18-2023, 01:17 PM
Man, they don't give those away. I gotta say tho, I have the tripod, work light and handheld lights and love them all :rock:
That one would be a nice addition :p
xj_man_646
04-18-2023, 04:31 PM
That is a legit setup. Might just need to get one of those.
https://i.imgur.com/goGfcrf.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/BQnweN5.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/sazGvHY.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/dyAPmiC.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/7IZTxmF.jpg
holy ... sh!t ... it is like a completely different truck now.
i LOVE how it looks, just cleaned everything up and gave it some flare. i think it all works pretty well together, even for the sport seats. but now i'm getting comments that the wood grain dash needs to go away soon.
the seats are amazing, Audi did them right. great support, great adjustability, just super comfy. even the "hard tail" rear springs are less noticeable with these.
the sound control changes are beyond expectation ... and maybe too much. the FTE resonator had a huge effect, and more than i expected. even with a bare steel floor i could have a conversation on the highway. but now with the dual applications of Lizard Skin on the floor and back wall, new carpet/heavy batting, and the killmat on the ceiling it's just dead. like the engine is almost becoming a generic white noise, and i think i hear the linkage on the exhaust brake rattling now. it's in eye sight of the driver if the shifter boot was off, so little to nothing stopping just that one noise :lol:
pretty soon i need to tow across the state, so more update coming.
xj_man_646
04-21-2023, 11:10 AM
That looks fantastic, Matt. That is awesome.
MBood82
04-21-2023, 12:51 PM
That has turned out really awesome. Must be a huge improvement over how you bought it, and it looked like it was a pretty good setup then!
thank you!
it's a huge win over before. the OG seats were the old, flat, zero support sofa kind of seats. good shape, reasonable comfort, but zero adjustability. the drivers seat was only fwd and back, the backrest was basically fixed. it was unlocked fwd, unlocked back, or upright. the passenger seat was the same back and fixed seat. now i can give the rear jump seat more room if needed.
the "velvet" seats also didn't let you move, it would just pull your pants off instead :lol:
Cobound
04-21-2023, 02:51 PM
:eek:
Wow, pimp daddy!!
Holy wow, dude, sweet job!!
nblehm
04-22-2023, 11:02 PM
Nice dude!
Funny on the Audi seats, my buddy is building a 85 crew cab dodge, and he just bought BMW seats for the front seats of his truck.
Dennis
04-25-2023, 08:13 PM
Damn Audi seats, I am locked into buying/leasing the German Four Rings in perpetuity for my wife due to them.
Great choice.
Damn Audi seats, I am locked into buying/leasing the German Four Rings in perpetuity for my wife due to them.
Great choice.
:lol: that's awesome, they really are THAT good.
i ended up having an Audi for a rental last year on a work road trip and quickly thought ... i need these in my truck! took me a bit to find some nice used ones local, but was worth the wait.
Dennis
04-26-2023, 04:51 PM
Volvo’s XC90’s were too hard, Explorer/Grand Cherokee’s were too soft, Audi Q7 were just perfect. :( :lol:
turns out when you buy the cheapest used transmission you can find within a lot of miles ... it's going to need rebuilt. there is a distinct rattle under load that comes with a loose bearing apparently. i guess these trans are a B!TCH to rebuild though. my goal is to get another cheap (for an NV5600) trans to rebuild and swap in, then rebuild the current for a spare. if i have any issues while rebuilding then the truck isn't down, and i bet i can hot-swap the trans in under 2hours.
i also just rebuilt the NP205 thinking it was that, but no ... so at least it's all new now too.
xj_man_646
06-13-2023, 09:43 AM
IIRC the NV5600 reputation is that rebuilds aren't cheap either. I'm somewhat surprised all the parts are still available for them, when the ZF-6 found in Duramax trucks is effectively bespoke now and a few components are only available in the used market.
5600 still has a big following, absolutely everything is still available. shops are even doing custom machining for better lubrication. i've seen ppl swap the 5600 in place of a g56, but never the other direction even. 5600 needs some better lubrication tricks, upgraded synchro's to handle the big dual disc clutch, and for crazy racing they'll do the cryo n shot peen gears. the g56 requires a full exo-skeliton to keep the AL case from twisting. they both have similar issues for rattle and longevity stock in non-competition use. wish they had stayed 5600, but i think that's when Daimler bought em.
if you buy a reman, they are like $3500 + $2000 core ... it's a bit crazy. other places are like $1500 just in labor + parts and shipping. the performance rebuilds are $4500 plus shipping. but complete rebuild kits are only about $550. upgraded synchro's are like $250. they also get you on tools though, some special sockets are needed. other nice to have pullers and such too.
thinking i can get myself set up, learn it and rebuild 2, then be ahead of the game. if i can get some core's to rebuild and sell i could make some pretty solid coin.
blower voltage was low so i started going back thru the system to find where the drop happens. as i did that, pulling and installing the connectors i gained 1+ volts at the blower! was enough of an increase that i stopped messing with the wiring and called it good. i have full voltage going into the blower speed switch, and even with the blower resistor unplugged the high speed voltage was low. i might try a new switch at some point.
next was the heater hose block off valve. the factory one had a functional diaphragm, but turns out the internal seals were gone and it didn't block anything. got this bypass loop valve from Amazon and it's awesome. plugged right into the hoses, sizes were perfect, just had to cut like 2" out of the other hose to let it fit in. new vac line and game on. took me a bit to realize the valve only closes in MAX-AC.
https://i.imgur.com/Ic4qWxf.jpg
I FIXED THE RATTLE!!
turns out, wasn't the transmission after all. had a buddy riding with me who could use both hands on the twin sticks and was able to quiet it right down. it had gotten bad enough that with only one hand I could barely get it to quite some. only thing i hadn't done diagnosing that was to throw the entire shifter on the bench and go for a drive. finally did after his ride.
the sticks are nice units with bronze bushings around the shoulder bolt, they were super smooth but did have side-to-side play. the bushings were loose on the bolt. i pressed them out, 3D printed some PETG bushings designed line-to-line for the bolt and shifter bore, and she's money! i wasn't sure they would survive being pressed onto both sides, but a few taps and it all slid together. there is now ZERO side to side play, but they still shift smooth. so much win, so much nicer! they have rattled from new.
last week i picked up a spare 5600 that was all torn down for rebuild, but never happened. i have all the rebuild parts, upgrade parts, etc ... even ordered a 50ton press. now i can get this together without feeling rushed and will probably still swap it in for the new-ness and upgrades. cross your fingers all the parts are actually there.
Hoofmann
08-03-2023, 07:33 PM
I love this truck. What a dream.
nblehm
08-04-2023, 08:51 AM
Question the the bushings. So when I converted my flat fender to Saginaw steering I had to make a bushing work for ejs in the end of the column it isn’t great. Just needs to support the steering shaft in the column. I thought about trying to 3d print one, but was worried it wouldn’t be strong enough, I also only have pla at the moment. Think switching to what you used would be strong enough? Obviously the bushing in a steering column will be used much more than a shifter bushing. The steering column is hollow so I could make the bushing as long as I want. They do make an 80 dollar bronze one that I could buy but 3d printing one would be more fun.
Question the the bushings. So when I converted my flat fender to Saginaw steering I had to make a bushing work for ejs in the end of the column it isnt great. Just needs to support the steering shaft in the column. I thought about trying to 3d print one, but was worried it wouldnt be strong enough, I also only have pla at the moment. Think switching to what you used would be strong enough? Obviously the bushing in a steering column will be used much more than a shifter bushing. The steering column is hollow so I could make the bushing as long as I want. They do make an 80 dollar bronze one that I could buy but 3d printing one would be more fun.
for steering i'd probably buy the bronze bushing
that said! could be interesting to see what happens. for mine, they are fully captured on all sides. as they get hot, they'll compact and if hot enough and not captured maybe try and squeeze out. PLA is a really low temp before it starts moving and squishing, PETG is stronger with a good bit more temp resistance but still not great. if your printer is capable of 300C print temp, you can get a steel tip and actually printer carbon fiber impregnated nylon. that chit will hold up to some temp!
pla in the sun in the summer will warp and sag ... PETG will move on a hot day in the sun in a closed up car on the dash. carbon filled nylon i think can be used as a water neck on the engine n stay solid.
nblehm
08-04-2023, 10:42 PM
Interesting. Thanks for the input. Right now I have a cut down Heim, but it isn’t the best.
well ... the rattle/ringing wasn't 100% gone ... stupid sticks :LOL:
they are still metal to metal on the tube welded to each stick for side to side spacing. i can make some PTFE washers and re-adjust the spacing the bolt bottoms on, but first i found this boot to try. CJ2a transfercase shirter boot. boot was a huge win, 2-fold. the ringing in the sticks was is 100% eliminated again. the flange and extra material also helped block more exhaust and road noise from coming up into the cab.
These sticks really need a plastic washer between them to damp them, but i'd need to grind/machine something to make room for it. that's my next step.
https://www.amazon.com/Omix-Ada-18606-01-Transfer-Case-Shifter/dp/B000FQ21R4/ref=sr_1_4?crid=14H44UQJFU09S&keywords=cj2a+shifter+boot&qid=1691412686&sprefix=cj2a+shifter+boot,aps,96&sr=8-4
https://i.imgur.com/Eisbjib.jpg
next was a new shifter, i ditched the chineesium short throw shifter from the picture above and installed a CORE shifter. talk about a night and day difference!! like going from pumping a Nerf blaster to ratcheting an old lever action Winchester. from soft and sometimes had to occasionally try again, to a mechanical masterpiece of precision. has nothing to do with speed shifting, the shorter throw is nicer, but it has EVERYTHING to do with the simple, solid, action. you know exactly where it's at at all time. anyone who claims they are louder must be driving a stock 3rd gen or something, cuz there was absolutely zero difference in my the 1st gen.
https://i.imgur.com/6DDFM2z.jpg
and finally ... hello, my name is Matt, and i have a problem. i hoard transmissions now.
multiple times when i was looking for a 5600 while dealing with the G360 issues, there was nothing to be found. or only over-priced swap kits for 2nd or 3rd gen trucks that i was not going to deal with. i finally found one, got it in the truck, got worried it might need rebuilt and started gathering parts/tools. well now i have 2 non-functional 5600 that need rebuilt, the tools, and the rebuild kits ... but where the hell am i going to get the time?!?!?! :lol:
first one is completely torn apart, but i believe has all the parts. the rear input bearing exploded and everything else looks minty. the 2nd was taken apart and refreshed by a guy, made it 1000miles, and has locked up. input and counter shaft spin ok, main shaft does not. since he replaced the 6th gear pair in the refresh, i'm guessing he tows in 6th. betting he burnt the first one, i have the receipt for the ebay gears that went back in it, and smoked it again. my hope is that it didn't weld/spin a bearing in the main case. at least that bit is available easy enough.
https://i.imgur.com/BI6ThGJ.jpg
xj_man_646
08-24-2023, 03:47 PM
Looks like some decent progress. This is one of the neatest 1st gen projects I've seen. I dig it.
started having oil psi concerns watching the gauge. no issue in the engine though! 60psi cold and 40 hot, we good.
there's something nice about the hood mounted gauge ... i mean, wiper arm mounted gauge :lol:
https://i.imgur.com/BBAm81w.jpg
xj_man_646
11-14-2023, 01:27 PM
Are they connected to different areas or is the gauge just failing?
right into the same port as the factory sensor ... pretty common for the sensor or wiring to **** in the old trucks now.
i'm debating if i just put an under-dash aftermarket in there so i know the actual value vs the factory 'nominal range'. eventually i'd like to re-do the dash with all new gauges anyways.
nblehm
11-18-2023, 10:44 AM
Do they make Dakota digital gauges for your truck? I have been really impressed with the ones I put in my j10. Was only a little more than doing my own autometer setup and looks almost factory.
they actually recently launched a kit for it! it has a rev counter thought and i have a factory option tach pod on the dash ... i'm torn over that.
my Friday did not go as planned, my annual state inspection found both front axle u-joints were TOAST. of the 8 total caps only 2 had what resembled grease left. only 2 others had what resembled needles left. :james: easy enough, i even already had spare joints since my crawler uses the same d60.
but then, with the truck already in the shop and up on stands ... i decided it was time that i dealt with the front springs. since I've owned it, i knew the springs hit the frame. i knew this junk bottomed out way too much. super short shackles that i guess are built to factory length, coupled with the lift spring that i suspect were made longer to keep the factory short shackle angle functional. going from a stiff to infinite spring rate doesn't make for a great ride. only way to fix that is to make a larger gap.
i had some 1.5" longer shackles made, giving an effective 0.75" lift. the math said my pinion and caster would change by ~1.5deg. i already could have used more pinion angle, not less, so i used some 2.5deg shims to slightly over compensate for the change. to account for the height i pulled leaves and also benefit from the slightly lighter spring rate. after shackles, shims, and pulling the smallest leaf i ended up 3/8" taller with +0.8deg pinion angle. crap, try again, took me 48min to rebuild the leaf packs again. i put the smallest leaf back and pulled the 2nd smallest. this put me back at EXACTLY the same height as before all this started and still had the +0.8deg at the pinion. all win.
truck rides WAY better in the front end! it steers and corners better even. it must have been hitting the frame way more than i thought it was. time to re-try the adjustable shocks to see what happens now. also gets me excited to rebuild the back with the GM leaves finally too.
https://i.imgur.com/Fc1wPtE.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/nTKgMs0.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/Ws4e9xn.jpg
Hoofmann
02-19-2024, 04:25 PM
Hahaha the front leaf springs on my ‘93 were the same. I always knew it was terrible for ride quality but I was too broke in college to do anything other than non-essential repairs.
somehow that makes me feel better that mine wasn't the only one :lol:
xj_man_646
02-20-2024, 08:51 AM
I wonder if that is the reason the 1st gen I test drove yeeeears ago rode like a hay wagon.
Hoofmann
02-20-2024, 11:50 AM
There is no question. Every first gen Cummins I’ve ever seen has springs like that.
they were known for being the worst riding of the era for sure. but i think mine was build to be even worse.
i have new springs for the back too. 1998 GM 1500 3" lift springs ... should be enough lift with a shackle reversal that i can remove the factory lift block entirely. plus the GM spring is 64" long vs the dodge at 53". the 64" spring swap is super common, and then i'll just use air bags for load capacity.
nblehm
02-21-2024, 08:27 AM
My buddy is swapping 63s under his first gen quad cab right now. I have thought a bunch about putting them under the back of the j10 as well. It’s got Alcan springs on it now but they were about 6” too tall so I have taken half the leafs out. Still doesn’t ride or flex like I hoped it would. Then I start thinking if I’m cutting off leaf brackets I should just 4 link it and total just stall the project :lol:
My buddy is swapping 63s under his first gen quad cab right now. I have thought a bunch about putting them under the back of the j10 as well. Its got Alcan springs on it now but they were about 6in too tall so I have taken half the leafs out. Still doesnt ride or flex like I hoped it would. Then I start thinking if Im cutting off leaf brackets I should just 4 link it and total just stall the project :lol:
:bangtard:
dude ... i am VERY familiar with that rabbit hole ... :lol:
don't tempt me, i've thought about a 4-link and bags in the back of Hank a few times. great load capacity, good ride, could kneel the truck to load/unload the bed, i already have the lower links to combat spring torque wrap, i have to have an air bag over the leaf for load capacity anyways and i have a full air system to go in already ...
the only reason i don't is the upper links or panhard are hard to fit around the fuel tank/exhaust, and the reliability and simplicity of the leaf
damn you ... now i'm thinking about it again ... but i already have all the hangers n new leafs!
nblehm
02-21-2024, 09:35 PM
:lol:
You already have the leafs, just get er done
vent door seal:
so i ended up using a 1/2" wide, 1/4" tall, 'very soft' peal n stick. tried a firm foam first and it was not good.
shift tower had all the bolts loose and was spilling fluid down the side of the trans. scared me when i saw a huge puddle of trans fluid, but easy fix. added the dual valve cover vent to hopefully huff less oil on the highway, tired of having to clean it off my tailgate n bumper. plus the engine was 3qt low ...
just got the heated seats wired into switches finally ... during the hottest week this year
door sill trim i ordered when i installed the new carpet has just been sitting around so i decided to also install that. why did i wait!??!!?
power steering pump went in a weird way, it just slowly reduced assistance until it finally started to cavitate at lower R's. big bumps would basically shove the fluid back up i think ... maybe the relief valve died? threw in a 2nd gen pump with the dual returns in case i ever swap to hydroboost.
both tabs for the map light finally broke off using them as a cell phone mount, so i redesigned things to clamp to the dash bezel. way way better solution it turns out.
in an attempt to reduce cabin heat and sound, i popped the down pipe out to wrap real quick. while doing that i found where the exhaust was hitting the floor and fixed that too! quick 'titanium' wrap, and back together where the turbo outlet v-band stripped... and this is where i sit currently waiting on shipping for that thing to show up.
and the best update yet, the one i cant' freakin wait to try out as soon as that v-band shows up, the one-pc drive shaft. getting rid of the absolutely TORCHED carrier bearing, and any possibility of it failing ever again. 1410 CV required a new flange yoke for the 205, that is actually a junk yard find front yoke from an np241 Cummins truck. had to get a new output seal since it had a smaller OD on the yoke, but that's easily available. by FAR the cheapest option was to buy the complete CV from Denny's drive shafts and have it built locally, was only $610 total. club cab/long bed, 5600/205, d80, is only a 70.5" shaft.
https://i.imgur.com/KqcXFVx.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/h6mwEYF.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/xGFhro6.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/hQye8by.jpg
HOLY CRAP!! it's like a whole new truck.
either the 2nd gen steering pump is that different, or the pump i had has been failing since before i bought this truck. everything about the steering is just clean now. well, and i greased everything up there :lol:
then the drive shaft, fawk, even the clutch is smoother. i knew the carrier bearing rubber was blown out, but would have never expected it to create excessive clutch chatter. i could drive around it, but now i don't have to. again, i've known it was fubar for about a year, but it's obviously been bad since before i got the truck.
xj_man_646
06-25-2024, 08:59 AM
:rock: that is awesome!
you ever do something and then instantly regret it? not cuz it's bad, but because it's going to cost you more money?
so i wanted to try the 35" ATs from this truck on my street rod jeep. same 8-lug, just thinking the lighter 35's might hoon around town better. so while i try that, i threw the 37's on the Ram ... and now i don't know that i can take them off.
if you look back at post #102, i confirmed i could spin the wheel in the tire while towing up my driveway. it takes serious initiative to tow 10,000lbs up. the prior wheels were "street locks" with just decorative rings, the racelines are for realz. so that's a plus. the 37's ride a touch better actually, but mostly they stretched out the gears juuust a little. with the 6spd it's really pretty good. i need to try towing and see how they do, but i feel like that'll be all fine. then it just looks right. slightly wider tire, slightly less backspacing, the MT, the machined face with the chrome ... if i'm going to have a big truck, it might as well just be proper big.
and the nitto's don't pick up and hold stones from the driveway to later throw at the paint when i get on the highway! so i took the mud flap off, it was never right but helped protect from the stones. i'll redo something different this winter maybe.
https://i.imgur.com/TFJaYNz.jpeg
https://i.imgur.com/41hFm3H.jpeg
https://i.imgur.com/79QWMOJ.jpeg
MBood82
10-01-2024, 11:04 AM
If you decide to keep 37s on the truck would you stick with the mud terrains or would you go with something more street friendly for towing?
37s look good under it, kind of like they belong on it. How well do they clear the wheel wells? Looks tight in the front at least, surely you don't want to start getting into cutting on that minty machine...?
xj_man_646
10-01-2024, 01:45 PM
Yeah the 37's look great. I'd love to do 37's on my truck someday...I think it needs the 4.30 gear option for that though.
Only down side (for me) is the hit to fuel economy and tire replacement costs. Sure does look good though!
ya know, i really think i'll stick with the MT's. truck had MT's when i got it and i went to AT's for all "the right reasons" ... but MT's might just be the correct choice. just sux these tires are dated 15th week of 2015 so i'll have to get new in the spring before towing season :james:
so these pics are at worst case turning clearance, still should be fine for daily/tow mode. it's actually mid- steer, at full lock it's way more room too. it would need clearance before i went crawling with it, but that's not going to be any time soon.
the TJ however has not faired well in this ... ew ... BUT, what i wanted to try that started all this was trying the lighter 35's on the TJ. would that be better for general hooning around, and it is. she holds the road better, a tiny bit quicker, and the gears feel a little bit closer. maybe these tires but with less stupid wheels?
https://i.imgur.com/9wXJ54H.jpeg
https://i.imgur.com/Wa5RIKf.jpeg
https://i.imgur.com/A4JWmAu.jpeg
xj_man_646
10-02-2024, 08:54 AM
Yeah, I do not like those wheels on the TJ. When is it getting an 8 lug front end?
Dennis
10-02-2024, 09:07 AM
I don't like those wheels on a KIA Telluride. :D
The 37s look great on the Dodge. The racelines are great wheels. Neighbor has them with black centers and the silver ring on his red Silverado, looks awesome.
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